differential shaft oil seal retainer removal

[CaperKen]

I have the left side of the final drive taken apart to replace the brakes and all gaskets and the oil seals.

Several years ago, one forum member indicated that it is easier to remove the oil seal by first removing the differential shaft oil seal triangular retainer.

Then another member said "Remove the bolts from both retainers. Lay the transmission on its left side. Take a hammer and a hearty brass drift and tap a corner of the retainer to get it to rotate about a quarter turn. Take two pry bars and gently apply pressure evenly on two of the corners being careful not to damage the shims. Once the right side is out, take a block of wood and a hammer and tap the left side out while the the transmission is still on its side."

I've removed the three bolts holding the differential shaft oil seal retainer but I have not removed the transmission.

Is there any way to remove that retainer that is easier than explained above? That method seems like it might be a bit prone to damage. The retainer on my Cub does not want to move at all. Is it better to just pry out the oil seal and leave the retainer attached?

[Glen]

Hi,
Yes, I would pry the oil seal out of the retainer.
The seal is probably sort of thick, if it is the original seal. It might take effort to remove it.
The new seals are probably thinner.

The retainer is thick, and has an o ring, that usually fits tight into the hole in the transmission housing.
The retainer also has shims, that adjust the spacing of the differential.
The shims can be damaged prying on the retainer to get it out, if you pry under the edge of the retainer.

Below are pics of the retainer from TM Tractor, the 3rd pic shows the thickness of it.

http://www.tmtractor.com/tm-tractor/gdi ... r1_001.htm

Below are pics from TM Tractor of the shims.

http://www.tmtractor.com/tm-tractor/gdi/shim_001.htm

If the retainer is not leaking from the o ring, which would probably be out the bottom of the retainer, you could leave it like it is.
But if you want to replace the o ring, you would need to remove the retainer.
Be careful of the shims, if you remove the retainer.
The shims need to be put in again, the same as they were, if you don't replace the bearing.

[CaperKen]

Thanks, Glen. The photos were very helpful.

There seems to have been leaking from the seal since the brake area was saturated with oil and other gunk.

Since I'm this far and there is leaking, does it seems that I'd be better off overall by removing the retainer, seal, shims and o-ring and replacing the seal and the o-ring? Does that seem sensible or should I just pry out the seal from the retainer?

Do you have any suggestions on the best way to remove that whole retainer unit?

[Don McCombs]

The leaking may be from an overfilled transmission. But, the end result is the same.

[Dale Finch]

I removed the retainers ONCE, since I tend to think "while I'm there...! BUT, it certainly opened up a bag of worms!!

Unless you are working on the differential, itself, I strongly recommend ONLY replacing the seals. That o-ring on the retainer is static, with little evidence of failures that I know of. You risk chipping or gouging the retainer, along with damaging those shims, which are very thin.

The original seals can be pried out, but they are small and quite thick, so be careful not to scratch or gouge the walls of the hole. I haven't used one, but perhaps some type of small slide hammer would work best (input on that from someone who has tried it?).

If prying it, do small amounts at a time all around to avoid "cocking" it at an angle, increasing difficulty.

Good luck!

[CaperKen]

Thanks, Dale. I read your past postings -- good advice. I can do without the worms.

One member advised starting a hole on opposite sides of the seal facing with and awl, screw in sheet metal screws and use a cats-foot to pry the seal out from each side, alternately. That seems workable to me. What do you think?

[tst]

just use a pry bar and it pops right out, no big deal

[Denny Clayton]

just use a pry bar and it pops right out, no big deal

Ditto.

Lot's of good advise above. I had heavily soaked brakes on one of my Cubs due to the PO overfilling the transmission by a couple of quarts. The seal is only meant to hold back the splashing of gear oil in the trans. The retainers are only held in place by the o-rings after the three bolts are removed. I pulled the retainers and knocked out the seals from the back side with the largest socket that was slightly smaller than the seal. Used the same socket to drive in the new seals, replaced the o-rings and put the same shims back on each and buttoned it up.

[CaperKen]

just use a pry bar and it pops right out, no big deal

Are you referring to the seal or the retainer?

[JustJim]

You've already received good advice, but on my '49, one of the retainers came right off while the other refused to budge. So on one side, I resorted to using a common hooked seal puller. It did take some force. I tried to muscle it and found my Cub (sans engine and up on blocks) bagan to creep off the blocks, so I changed my approch and used a mallet to tap the handle of the seal puller rather than putting so much "english" on the chassis.

Botom line - it's easier if you can remove the retainer, but if it fights you, just go to work on the seal where it is. Good luck on your project!

[tst]

pry bar on the seal, no need to remove the retainer

[CaperKen]

OK, thanks tst.

[Barnyard]

Check the trans for overfill before anything else as mentioned. You may not need to remove any seals or gaskets.

[electricjake]

How can I tell if my leak is from an overfilled transmission?

[Barnyard]

How can I tell if my leak is from an overfilled transmission?

Check to see if it is over full. There is a plug on the side of the trans. That is the "fill to point". If you take the top off and the oil loos like a milk shake you might as drain the trans, run about 3 pints of fuel oil in it for about 5 minutes, drain again and refill with 90w lube.


Photo Courtesy of TM Tractor.