Hi there, I just joined here, been looking at the old posts. Looks like a great bunch of guys. I just bought a 1872 Cub Cadet with a 52? mower and a 42? snow blower. It has 850 hours on it and I got it from the original owner. I also have a 1200 with a mower and blower. That machine needs a new engine or rebuild. My nephew got mad at me and drained the oil and put in dish soap and dirt and ran the bygum out of it. I also have a Super M International, 2 WD AC's , 2 Model B AC's. and other junk. I was wondering if it was feasable to put on the bigger mower deck on the 1872? Are there any for sale? I have a pretty big meadow I want to mow. As I get to know this machine I'll have more questions. Thanks Brian
Hello, I'm new
- Thread starter DoOver
- Start date
beaconlight
501 Club
Has the nephew been released from the hosp yet? Or was he DOA?
Bill
Bill
gitractorman
501 Club
Your 1872 should be able to handle the big 60" mowers that were available on later super garden tractors. Most of them were built by Danco for CC, and are much better, heavier mowers. Too bad you are a few months late. I had one off of a 2182 that the engine and tranny had blown up, and just sold it back in Dec.
They are expensive, and sometimes hard to find. I had someone buy a whole 1872 tractor from me last year, just because he wanted the 60" mower. Keep an eye open on e-bay, and you'll eventually run across one.
You may want to look for the Honda replacement kit engine for that tractor too. It will run you over $1000, but it is one hell of a setup. Check the post by Fordlords, he just installed one in a CC682, and knows the e-bay contact where they are sold. The Kohler engines are pretty good, and if it has not been overhauled before, and if the crank or connecting rod is not broke, you should be able to rebuild it for under $800, but it can be costly.
Best of luck,
Bill
They are expensive, and sometimes hard to find. I had someone buy a whole 1872 tractor from me last year, just because he wanted the 60" mower. Keep an eye open on e-bay, and you'll eventually run across one.
You may want to look for the Honda replacement kit engine for that tractor too. It will run you over $1000, but it is one hell of a setup. Check the post by Fordlords, he just installed one in a CC682, and knows the e-bay contact where they are sold. The Kohler engines are pretty good, and if it has not been overhauled before, and if the crank or connecting rod is not broke, you should be able to rebuild it for under $800, but it can be costly.
Best of luck,
Bill
Hi Bill, I just read that post about the Honda. That might be good for my 1200. To correct my first post I have a 50" mower and a 45" blower. Thank you for the info on the 60" mower, I have to keep my eyes peeled. I put the blower on today hoping for snow tomorrow, this is one sweet smooth machine!. I've never had a tractor like it. Thanks Brian
Small Engine Warehouse does not have a Honda twin for the 1200, but lists a Briggs Vanguard 14 HP twin conversion kit for the 1200. But, the original K series full cast iron Kohler singles were incredible engines (Unlike the KT twins), and still available new if the tractor is worthy of the cost of one. It costs $1100 new, and the Briggs twin conversion kit is $1150.00. In the case of those earlier model Cubs if investing in new power I'd probably keep it original with a new Kohler K series single. Send the bill to your nephew 
-Fordlords-
-Fordlords-
Nice 682, it is gorgeous. I still kick myself for not taking pictures of my 107 the day i drug it home. Everyone who saw it before and after still doesn't believe it's the same machine. :wink:
Good luck with finding super garden tractor implements. They are around, but hard and expensive to come by in my experiance. I jsut saw a 982 two days ago... and the asking price was $3995... with "300" hours on it. I nearly told the guy selling it that i know that trick too... I.E... disconnecting/changing the hour meter.... There was no way that machine had 300 hours on it. It was ridden hard and put away wet.
Good luck with finding super garden tractor implements. They are around, but hard and expensive to come by in my experiance. I jsut saw a 982 two days ago... and the asking price was $3995... with "300" hours on it. I nearly told the guy selling it that i know that trick too... I.E... disconnecting/changing the hour meter.... There was no way that machine had 300 hours on it. It was ridden hard and put away wet.
Here is the 682 before I got it from gitractorman. It was just an original 682 with about 700 hours, which looking at it seemed right for its condition for someone using it to mow an acre or so every summer for the past 25 years. It was maintained and not real beat up, just showed its age and the normal issues for a GT of its age. It was in 100% restorable condition at a reasonable price, and I really enjoyed the projects of repowering it, cleaning and repainting, and installing new spindles and other components on to the brand new 44" deck housing.
This beastie was built for go and not show, but the new base-clear paint that I only expected to be presentable turned out to be sweet. I added a lot of better than new goodies such as all corrosion resistant grade 8 hardware, a new Hobbs hour meter and ammeter, completely new lighting and wiring, Kevlar mule and deck belts, diamond plate footrests, new rims and Carlisle tires, and fresh decals, etc. A VERY fun winter project, and although admittingly expensive was all done for less than the cost of a new Cub 2554 tractor, inclusive of the initial cost of the used 682, and I think (well, know) I ended up with a much better machine.
B-4 Pix:
-Fordlords-
This beastie was built for go and not show, but the new base-clear paint that I only expected to be presentable turned out to be sweet. I added a lot of better than new goodies such as all corrosion resistant grade 8 hardware, a new Hobbs hour meter and ammeter, completely new lighting and wiring, Kevlar mule and deck belts, diamond plate footrests, new rims and Carlisle tires, and fresh decals, etc. A VERY fun winter project, and although admittingly expensive was all done for less than the cost of a new Cub 2554 tractor, inclusive of the initial cost of the used 682, and I think (well, know) I ended up with a much better machine.
B-4 Pix:
-Fordlords-
gitractorman
501 Club
Fordlords,
Man, you did a hell of a nice job on that tractor. I'm glad to see that it worked out so well for you. I never imagined, when I delivered it to you in 3-degree weather, that you would turn it around so quickly, and make such a nice machine out of it. I'm sure, as you know, that tractor will last for a long time.
Hey, you should consider bringing it out to one of the local shows. There is one on May 7 out in Elba, NY, then there is another in Williamsville, in either later May or early June. I'm sure lots of people would be interested to see the Honda conversion, (including me).
Great work!
Bill
Man, you did a hell of a nice job on that tractor. I'm glad to see that it worked out so well for you. I never imagined, when I delivered it to you in 3-degree weather, that you would turn it around so quickly, and make such a nice machine out of it. I'm sure, as you know, that tractor will last for a long time.
Hey, you should consider bringing it out to one of the local shows. There is one on May 7 out in Elba, NY, then there is another in Williamsville, in either later May or early June. I'm sure lots of people would be interested to see the Honda conversion, (including me).
Great work!
Bill
gitractorman
501 Club
Do-over,
You may want to look at that same re-power kit as Fordlords did on the 682, for your 1200. I'm not 100% sure, but the mounting should be almost identical between the 682 and the 1200. I don't believe that they changed any of the frames on the quietlines, wether youre looking at an early QL 1200 -vs- a later QL682. In fact, the 582 would have been the exactly same tractor as your 1200, using a 12-hp Kohler single cylinder engine.
I know that there was some sheet-metal changes in the *82 series, to promote better ventilation and heat release from the engine, so the only hangup that I could forsee is the shroud around the muffler may need to be trimmed or modified a little.
Other than that, the tractors are nearly identical.
Besides that, the 18hp Honda would run circles around that old 12hp Kohler.
Best of luck,
Bill
You may want to look at that same re-power kit as Fordlords did on the 682, for your 1200. I'm not 100% sure, but the mounting should be almost identical between the 682 and the 1200. I don't believe that they changed any of the frames on the quietlines, wether youre looking at an early QL 1200 -vs- a later QL682. In fact, the 582 would have been the exactly same tractor as your 1200, using a 12-hp Kohler single cylinder engine.
I know that there was some sheet-metal changes in the *82 series, to promote better ventilation and heat release from the engine, so the only hangup that I could forsee is the shroud around the muffler may need to be trimmed or modified a little.
Other than that, the tractors are nearly identical.
Besides that, the 18hp Honda would run circles around that old 12hp Kohler.
Best of luck,
Bill
gitractorman
501 Club
DoOver
Check this out. Should be what you're looking for.
http://cgi.ebay.com/CUB-CADET-60-INCH-D ... dZViewItem
These are built really heavy, out of plate steel and diamond plate, rather than stamped sheet metal, so a little surface rust is not a big deal at all. Looks like it's missing some gauge wheels and stuff, as there should be a set of wheels and adjusters on each front corner, but I'm would bet that the stuff is still available.
The one I just sold, same as this one, weighed over 200 pounds, and it was all I could do to just move it around the shop by myself. Really heavy built!.
Check this out. Should be what you're looking for.
http://cgi.ebay.com/CUB-CADET-60-INCH-D ... dZViewItem
These are built really heavy, out of plate steel and diamond plate, rather than stamped sheet metal, so a little surface rust is not a big deal at all. Looks like it's missing some gauge wheels and stuff, as there should be a set of wheels and adjusters on each front corner, but I'm would bet that the stuff is still available.
The one I just sold, same as this one, weighed over 200 pounds, and it was all I could do to just move it around the shop by myself. Really heavy built!.
Yea Bill, that's what I need! What's your opinion on a winning/top end price? Also will an 18 HP engine work in that 1200 I have? I found a link for a puller that rebuilds Kohlers on this site. He also makes hard motor mounts. That 1200 always has motor mount, clutch problems. In fact that's how I got it, the owner didn't want to spend another $400.00 on a clutch.Brian
Fordlord, I just reread your post, I would rather rebuild my 12hp Kohler, or get a new one, 12hp or larger like you said. Do you have a link for new Kohler engines? No offense against the Honda, but I know and remember to many men who fought "overthere', I don't want to forget. Brian
gitractorman
There are several difference's in the QL frames (1200) and the 82 series frames (682), enough that they are not interchangable. The front section of the frame rails are not as tall on the 82 series, and the QL's use a pair of engine mounting rails and rubber ISO mounts to mount the engine to the frame, and the 682 and other 82 series except the 482, use an engine mounting plate and steel spacers to mount the engine. The 482 used a 11 hp B&S single cylinder engine and a pair of mount rails, cross bars, and ISO mounts similar to the QL's.
The 582, and 582 Special, had a B&S, flat, twin cylinder engine in it. CCC did build a model 1282 from 1982 to 1985, that used a single cylinder Kohler like the 1200 QL. I don't know if it was the same spec number engine or not, but was the same basic K301 AQS engine that was used in the 1200/1250 QL's.
There are several difference's in the QL frames (1200) and the 82 series frames (682), enough that they are not interchangable. The front section of the frame rails are not as tall on the 82 series, and the QL's use a pair of engine mounting rails and rubber ISO mounts to mount the engine to the frame, and the 682 and other 82 series except the 482, use an engine mounting plate and steel spacers to mount the engine. The 482 used a 11 hp B&S single cylinder engine and a pair of mount rails, cross bars, and ISO mounts similar to the QL's.
The 582, and 582 Special, had a B&S, flat, twin cylinder engine in it. CCC did build a model 1282 from 1982 to 1985, that used a single cylinder Kohler like the 1200 QL. I don't know if it was the same spec number engine or not, but was the same basic K301 AQS engine that was used in the 1200/1250 QL's.
gitractorman
501 Club
DoOver,
If your Kohler is running, and you want to stick with a Kohler, I would opt to rebuild yours. The "pulling" guys have a-lot of tricks to get some extra hp out of your stock Kohler, and if you found a guy to do a rebuild, that is where I would head.
The 1000 series was available with 14 and 16hp engines, but, if I remember right, the 1450 and 1650 had slight frame modifications to allow for the bigger engines. I believe the 1650 had a section cut out of the frame to allow space for the larger flywheel, but don't quote me.
Honestly, I think I would stick with the same 12-hp and a rebuild. You could re-build it a couple of times for the price of a new one. Now, if the connecting rod or crank broke, or the engine is siezed, throw it away. I have never seen a rebuilt Kohler, where one of these things has happened, that lasted more than 100 hours. I have seen a few even that lasted for only 1 lawn mowing, and then blew up again. IF you go for a rebuild, go to someone who REALLY knows Kohlers.
As for motor mounts. I have mixed feelings about the solid mounts, but many guys swear by them, and those guys may have a-lot more experience with them than I do. My uncle had a 1000 that I must have put 3 clutches in, then finally upgraded the ISO mounts to the new replacement ISO mounts, and that clutsh is still running after 6 years. He mows about 3 acres with it.
That mower on e-bay is not all there, missing the casters and guage wheels, I would guess that it should not go for more than $150 or $200. Mine was complete, in very good condition, with no rust, and I got $500 for it. If you grab that one on e-bay, be prepared to spend some $$ to get the missing parts. They are big, heavy duty casters and such, and probably will run you another $100, if I had to guess.
If your Kohler is running, and you want to stick with a Kohler, I would opt to rebuild yours. The "pulling" guys have a-lot of tricks to get some extra hp out of your stock Kohler, and if you found a guy to do a rebuild, that is where I would head.
The 1000 series was available with 14 and 16hp engines, but, if I remember right, the 1450 and 1650 had slight frame modifications to allow for the bigger engines. I believe the 1650 had a section cut out of the frame to allow space for the larger flywheel, but don't quote me.
Honestly, I think I would stick with the same 12-hp and a rebuild. You could re-build it a couple of times for the price of a new one. Now, if the connecting rod or crank broke, or the engine is siezed, throw it away. I have never seen a rebuilt Kohler, where one of these things has happened, that lasted more than 100 hours. I have seen a few even that lasted for only 1 lawn mowing, and then blew up again. IF you go for a rebuild, go to someone who REALLY knows Kohlers.
As for motor mounts. I have mixed feelings about the solid mounts, but many guys swear by them, and those guys may have a-lot more experience with them than I do. My uncle had a 1000 that I must have put 3 clutches in, then finally upgraded the ISO mounts to the new replacement ISO mounts, and that clutsh is still running after 6 years. He mows about 3 acres with it.
That mower on e-bay is not all there, missing the casters and guage wheels, I would guess that it should not go for more than $150 or $200. Mine was complete, in very good condition, with no rust, and I got $500 for it. If you grab that one on e-bay, be prepared to spend some $$ to get the missing parts. They are big, heavy duty casters and such, and probably will run you another $100, if I had to guess.
gitractorman
501 Club
PaulB,
Thanks for the help. Man, I hate mixing stuff up. I knew it too, because I had a 582 with the 16hp briggs. Just too many numbers to keep straight.
Now, i never pulled the engines, but aren't the ISO mounts from the 82 series very similar to the ISO replacement mounts for the 1000 series? This is why I thought you could interchange the engines. I knew that the frames were lower in the 82 series, to make room for the V-Kohler engines, but I thought the engine mounts were still the same.
Now I'm more curious to know the answer. I need to learn something every day :lol:
Thanks for the help. Man, I hate mixing stuff up. I knew it too, because I had a 582 with the 16hp briggs. Just too many numbers to keep straight.
Now, i never pulled the engines, but aren't the ISO mounts from the 82 series very similar to the ISO replacement mounts for the 1000 series? This is why I thought you could interchange the engines. I knew that the frames were lower in the 82 series, to make room for the V-Kohler engines, but I thought the engine mounts were still the same.
Now I'm more curious to know the answer. I need to learn something every day :lol:
The narrow frame 147 had modified frame rails to allow the larger flywheel and the housing to fit in the narrow frame. The frame was changed to the wide frame with the 86-169 models, where the front part of the frame is wider starting about the front of the dash pedestal to the front - about 13-1/2" wide compared to about 11" wide for the narrow frame. The purpose was to allow the for the larger fyywheel of the 14-16 hp engines. The wide frames continued through the end of the IH production and into the Cub Cadet Corp models. The rear frame rail width is the same for both narrow and wide frames.
To my knowledge, the rubber ISO mounts were not used on the 582, 582S, 682, 782, 982, or the CCC yellow/white versions of the same models, and the ISO mounts are not shown in the part manuals for these models, that I can find.
You are correct about the driveline damage caused by worn out ISO mounts on the QL's. The flex center of the clutch drive disc would crack /break, cause the ends of the driveshaft to wear on both gear drive and hydro models etc, and it gets very pricey replacing these parts (clutch drive disc is in the $85 range the last one I bought). Although I like the early narrow frame tractors, in my opinion, the 149 is about the best all around model IH built - came with hydraulic lift, lights, etc. as standard equipment. The 129 is about the same , but with a 12 hp engine and less standard features, the 169 is about the same but with a lot more shake and vibration from the 16 hp engine, and most were built with a manual lift because of a parts shortage. Although a hydraulic lift retro kit for the 169 became available about 3 months after production of the tractor ended, I would say the majority of them were never converted.
To my knowledge, the rubber ISO mounts were not used on the 582, 582S, 682, 782, 982, or the CCC yellow/white versions of the same models, and the ISO mounts are not shown in the part manuals for these models, that I can find.
You are correct about the driveline damage caused by worn out ISO mounts on the QL's. The flex center of the clutch drive disc would crack /break, cause the ends of the driveshaft to wear on both gear drive and hydro models etc, and it gets very pricey replacing these parts (clutch drive disc is in the $85 range the last one I bought). Although I like the early narrow frame tractors, in my opinion, the 149 is about the best all around model IH built - came with hydraulic lift, lights, etc. as standard equipment. The 129 is about the same , but with a 12 hp engine and less standard features, the 169 is about the same but with a lot more shake and vibration from the 16 hp engine, and most were built with a manual lift because of a parts shortage. Although a hydraulic lift retro kit for the 169 became available about 3 months after production of the tractor ended, I would say the majority of them were never converted.