Circle Cubs and CTdave

G

goldencub

Well-known member
Dave - you said "it appears that 8/29/47 is about the last day of the Circle Cubs". How did you arrive at that date? My serial # is 4364 and engine cast date is 8/13/Q (47), and I would very much like to have it an "honest" Circle Cub. According to my feeble attempt at math, if there were 10,846 units made in 1947, and number 3081 was off the line on Aug 1 - supposedly the first number after the circle was to have been dropped (?) - then 8266 units were produced between Aug 1 and the end of the year - an average of 1653 per month. My Cub would have been the 1283rd unit produced in August, which might put it in the 3rd week of that month, which is comfortably ahead of your 8/29 date.

You can see why your comment got my attention! I am in the process of stripping layers of brushed-on paint by PO's and will go very carefully when I get to those side panels in hopes of seeing some vague indication of a circle decal. Obviously, if there is some such sign, I will advise everyone! Al
 
I suspect that CTdave intended to say July. Guy Fay's Letter Series book quotes the decision to drop the circle decal as July 28, 1947. The serial numbers for August were 3081 through 4820, inclusive.
 
What we know:

The IH decision to discontinue the Circle decal was made on July 28, 1947.
The first Cub finished on August 1, 1947 was #3081. (The first Cub built on September 1, 1947 was #4821.)

What we don't know:

Did they use up any extra Circle decals they had on-hand after the decision was made?

If you do find evidence of the original decals on your tractor, by all means let us know. Look for the circles on the doglegs, of course, but you don't have to stop there. Also, the hood decal would have read "McCormick-Deering Farmall" for the Circle Cubs, instead of "McCormick-Deering Farmall Cub."
 
I have serial number 4003 and at the time I applied the new decals I was told mine was not a Circle Cub so I did not put it on. I have however seen the decal used on restored tractors in the 1949 era.

Bob
 
Bob Grieb":2yk1mjtp said:
I have serial number 4003 and at the time I applied the new decals I was told mine was not a Circle Cub so I did not put it on. I have however seen the decal used on restored tractors in the 1949 era.

Bob
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Bob,
People do it all the time. Is it a crime? Nope. We are talking about a decoration. Kind of like people putting GTO emblems on a LeMans. The car is exactly the same & nobody would know the difference unless there was proof to the contrary. Like Trent said, the problem is with when the decision was made on 7/28/47 (thanks for the correction Jim) and when the production line actually stopped putting the stickers on. They probably didn't call down from the board room & say "change it & throw away the left over decals". This is the gray area in the circle cub debate. Take that paint off carefully!
 
Hey Podge, there's another question for your friend when he comes back in the shop. Bring him to the Bash with you. You can pump him for info on the way up and I'll spring for his motel room. It's a long shot but, he may remember some about it.
 
Al, my cub is very close to yours, #4371, there were no decals on mine I called Jim about a year ago and he told me it was in the very gray area and could go either way, sense I like the circles that is what I put on but it would be good to know for sure. Now let me throw this monkey wrench at you guys, the decals could have been alternated for a few days if the guy putting them on wanted to see what the new ones looked like before the old ones were gone?????????????????. We may never know for sure. Chuck
 
Well, two disappointments today. The first: I got the left side dogleg off (with help from the Blaster) and carefully removed the paint. No sign of a circle. The top paint layer was brushed-on red, the second layer was a pale yellow - not the color of zinc chromate primer - and the bottom layer was a dull reddish brown, probably the original primer. I don't know what to make of that middle yellow layer. The right dogleg is still soaking in Blaster, but I'm pretty sure it will turn out the same way. And I was hoping for that circle!

The second: The project for the day was to remove and disassemble the front axle and all the components. Everything went OK but I can't get the left front wheel off!! What a pain-in-the-xxx!!! To be flummoxed by something like that!!! So it's soaking in blaster now, too.

Thanks Trent for the info about the serial # for the first Sept 47 Cub. I had not seen that before, and it verifies my conclusion that mine was produced in the latter part of Aug that year. I may just put a circle on mine just for the fun of it. Al
 
Bob, I'm with you on this one. I own Cub No. 4028 and don't know whether the decision to discontinue the circle made it to the factory floor before or after mine was built. I'm hoping to come to the Bash. Maybe I can learn something about this.

Steve.43
 
Those dog legs may not be original to the Cub or someone has stripped and repainted them. I remember someone saying the early Cubs were not primed before painting.

I doubt if IH had someone rush onto the production floor and swap out the decals right after the change meeting. Some bean counter probably already figured it all out, IH could save 10 cents per Cub by eliminating the Circle Cub decals but they'd use up the existing stock before switching to the new decal set.
 
I've been thinking about this today and there are just too many questions that might never be answered.

We have a date from a document where some men in a room somewhere "officially" made a decision. Was this the beginning of the change-over process? If so, how long would it have taken to get a production supply of the "McCormick-Deering Farmall Cub" decals ready to be put on each tractor in 1947. They made nearly 2,000 tractors in August, that's nearly 100 tractors per day. They would have needed alot of them. Then there is the possibility that it was not the beginning of the process and the real "decision" was already made. They already had a proof made up at least, then the formalities of signing the documents were done on that day in late July. Or maybe they even already had boxes and boxes of them ready to go?

I sure would like to see proof of original Circles, or the proper hood decal, on a Cub with a serial number higher than 3000, then we would at least know some more. I don't know why I'm so interested in this, the closest I have to a Circle Cub is about 52,000 serial numbers too high. Just the thrill of the hunt I guess? :D
 
Trent M":3or8e1q3 said:
...I don't know why I'm so interested in this, the closest I have to a Circle Cub is about 52,000 serial numbers too high. Just the thrill of the hunt I guess? :D
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For the same reason I am chasing those 1948 Cubs with the rare dash panel. I think those would be easier to pinpoint as far as when they were used and I bet there were fewer of those than there were Circle Cubs. Maybe fewer than there were Demo Cubs.
 
For the same reason I am chasing those 1948 Cubs with the rare dash panel. I think those would be easier to pinpoint as far as when they were used and I bet there were fewer of those than there were Circle Cubs. Maybe fewer than there were Demo Cubs.[/quote]

What is the difference between a regular dash panel and the "rare" dash panel? Find me a 3 digit circle bub & I'll find you your rare panel :idea:
 
I have a 48 Cub that appears fairly original. What is the "rare dash panel" mentioned by Barnyard? Anyone have a picture they could post? Thanks!!!
 
Jim:

Here's a guess: This Cub has the short lever on the starter button and the stick is for leverage.

Steve
 
Steve.43":2ia0fmls said:
Jim:

Here's a guess: This Cub has the short lever on the starter button and the stick is for leverage.

Steve
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I think you are probably right. It is a short lever, probably combined with a failing switch.
Bob Grieb":2ia0fmls said:
Maybe it's a pull starter
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But I do like this idea. Wrap a rope a few times around the PTO shaft and give it a pull.
 
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