Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

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Jim Becker
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Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Jim Becker » Fri May 01, 2015 11:05 pm

Paint is a frequent topic of discussion on this site. These discussions often bring up suggestions on the use of hardeners. Anyone using hardeners needs to be aware of the hazards. Hardeners contain isocyanates. Isocyanates are toxic. The effect is severe and cumulative. They can be absorbed through inhalation or skin contact and can even pass through latex gloves. Cartridge masks are largely ineffective at filtering isocyanates. The charcoal quickly absorbs its limit then allows the odorless toxin to pass through.

Hardeners should only be used with approved safety equipment including full coverage protective clothing, nitrile gloves, and a supplied-air respirator. Since I know that all the warnings in the world will be ignored by some, I urge you to at least read the following threads. They were written by two survivors that speak from their own experience.

First, the effects of many years of repeated low exposures.

Here is one post with a warning:

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=77584&#p621826

And three more posts that show why it is a good idea to pay attention to his warning:

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=82341

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=82341&start=30#p662576

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=85384

If the story on low level exposure isn't enough to get your attention, here is an example of a single higher level exposure. Be sure to read all the posts in the thread that were made by JGtools:

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=39149

If you are interested in a little more on the topic, here is a fairly old thread that started with a question about paint and migrated to safety equipment. Note the comments Rudi made several years before he made the posts above. The posts from the late George Willer are worthy of close attention.
http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=21431

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John *.?-!.* cub owner
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Sat May 02, 2015 5:37 am

Thanks JIm, gpp0d reminders to all, especially those who feel they are invincible. George Willer made a post several years ago going into more details about his problems and their causes, but I have not been able to find it.
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you are part of the problem!!!

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Don McCombs
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Don McCombs » Sat May 02, 2015 4:33 pm

Thanks, Jim. If we keep reminding, maybe some day it will sink in.
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Rob in NH
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Rob in NH » Sat May 02, 2015 5:55 pm

here is an air fed repirator on craiglist, price is right. http://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/tls/5001719663.html
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby leerenovations » Tue Aug 25, 2015 10:35 pm

Just a quick add on about these chemicals. Isocyanates are a major component of carbariyl (AKA Sevin), it is highly toxic.


If you want to know how toxic this chemical is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster


Worst industrial disaster in history. So please observe all pertinent safety protocols when working with these.
Tractors are like watermelons: the RED is good and you throw away the GREEN.

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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Jason (IL) » Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:21 pm

I have been doing a lot of spraying at school and a little bit in my own shop on tractors. Spraying Lacquer at first with just a half mask was about a painful as I ever wanted to experience. The back spray would get in my eyes and would burn. Same with tractor paints. I have used a 3m mask before and didn't really like it. So I switched to a North Brand mask and got a half mask and full face mask. I'll just say I tried the full face mask first and I have maybe used the half mask a few times. I have attached a Ebay link to the mask I have been using for 3 yrs now and like it. I change filter every 3 or 4 sprayings.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/NORTH-BY-HONEYWELL-54001-North-TM-5400-Full-Face-Respirator-M-L-/221549534207?hash=item3395619bff

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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Jim Becker » Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:31 pm

Jason (IL) wrote:I have been doing a lot of spraying at school and a little bit in my own shop on tractors. Spraying Lacquer at first with just a half mask was about a painful as I ever wanted to experience. The back spray would get in my eyes and would burn. Same with tractor paints. I have used a 3m mask before and didn't really like it. So I switched to a North Brand mask and got a half mask and full face mask. I'll just say I tried the full face mask first and I have maybe used the half mask a few times. I have attached a Ebay link to the mask I have been using for 3 yrs now and like it. I change filter every 3 or 4 sprayings.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/NORTH-BY-HONEYWELL-54001-North-TM-5400-Full-Face-Respirator-M-L-/221549534207?hash=item3395619bff

Keep in mind that this mask is ineffective in protecting from isocyanates.

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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby Bob McCarty » Wed Aug 26, 2015 3:38 pm

From Jim's post: " They can be absorbed through inhalation or skin contact and can even pass through latex gloves. Cartridge masks are largely ineffective at filtering isocyanates."

DON'T USE HARDENER WITHOUT A FULL SUIT AND SUPPLIED AIR SYSTEM.

Bob
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we need to think differently."
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bob in CT
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby bob in CT » Wed Aug 26, 2015 4:38 pm

People get a false sense of security because an organic cartridge will absorb the paint solvents. No smell and people think they are safe. Isocyanates have no odor and for the most part they pass right through organic cartridges after just minutes of use.

leerenovations
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Re: Paint Hardeners Will Kill You

Postby leerenovations » Wed Aug 26, 2015 10:09 pm

Im a firefighter and they drill into us that you cannot live without your lungs. And just because it doesn't get you immediately doesn't mean it doesn't have you, it might take several years. Those cool SCBAs we wear into fires isn't just to keep smoke from making us cough. There is a lot of bad stuff in smoke and off gasses. This is also another good time to remind you about solvents and cleaners that are on metal before you weld them. Heat causes chemicals to decompose and produce very bad stuff. All of that methylethyldeath stuff on the label of paint and other chemicals is nasty stuff.
Tractors are like watermelons: the RED is good and you throw away the GREEN.


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