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LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

IH CUB Lo-Boy Series - 154, 184, 185 Forum -- Questions and answers to all of your Lo-Boy related issues.
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elmrfudd
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Zip Code: 43413

LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Fri Apr 07, 2023 2:39 pm

I need some expertise in getting this LoBoy 154 running. Right now, the symptoms are, while cranking the engine: a small amount of smoke coming out of the muffler, consistent coughing out of the carburetor, especially after closing the choke. After choking, the carburetor air intake fills up with gas and leaks out everywhere. Here are the procedures I’ve already done:
Ultrasonic cleaning and installed new carburetor kit
Replaced spark plugs, points & condenser, rotor, & cap, along with correct points gap and firing order of plug wires
Pulled valve cover, and used penetrant/lube to free valves (from what I can see, it appears that all valves are functioning, but symptoms indicate possibility of valves not seating or timing issues. Yesterday I had flames coming out the carb air intake.)

I can only see the valves in the cylinder #1 plug hole, but would need to pull the fuel tank to look into holes 2, 3, & 4. Is this coughing back through the carb causing it to flood out the air intake? What should my cold cylinder compression read? I’d like to think the carburetor is not the culprit since I cleaned and rebuilt it, but the engine should not be pushing excess gas and air mixture out the carb, instead of pulling it in. (back pressure in the intake) I can’t figure out if it’s valves sticking or not seating, spark timing, or carb failure. Any advice appreciated!

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staninlowerAL
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Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1 is for parts), (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (2)154 Number Series Loboys, (1 is for parts), '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '47 & '49 Avery V, '53 MM BG (offset), '51 JD M (regular), '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76? Yanmar 2TR15 1500 & Bush Hog SQ42S-2 mower, '78? FORD Dexta, '86 FORD LGT14D & 48" Mower, (2)Cub Cadets & Mowers (MTD), (4) Sears Surburban's, other MTD mowers, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby staninlowerAL » Fri Apr 07, 2023 4:54 pm

Check all the electrical system grounds, try moving the battery ground from the sheet metal to the chassis. Clean and adequately sized battery cables is a must, typically the SG does not spin the engine very fast. Double check the timing/correct connections from the distributor to the plugs (firing order). Good Luck with your LoBoy. Stan
Stan in LA (lower AL)
USAF & Reserves, Reg ARMY, ARMY NG (AL)

Eugene
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Eugene » Fri Apr 07, 2023 7:16 pm

Ignition timing. Tripple check.
I have an excuse. CRS.

elmrfudd
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:27 am

I know the timing sequence is supposed to be 1-3-4-2, and I’ve checked my wire routing at least ten times, and that’s assuming from front to rear, the cylinders are in lined up in numerical order 1,2,3,4. I know this sounds like ignition timing to me as well, but wouldn’t it behave similarly if one (or more) of the intake valves weren’t seating properly. Also, would both of those situations cause gas to run out the front of the carb? Can we rule out the distributor being off kilter? I also replaced the battery (500 CCA) and cable clamps as well. Battery connections are all good, and not sure why ground connection would affect timing. It’s been pretty frustrating thus far, as my thoughts were clean and rebuild carb, replace cap, rotor, points, condenser, verify plug wire routing, and new battery would nip it in the bud. Made some progress, but still not starting, as previously there was no spark at all to the plugs, but have spark now. Thanks for your input, but could still use additional opinions.

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Rick Spivey
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Rick Spivey » Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:43 am

The gas running out of the carburetor throat is normal for an updraft carb in a "no start" situation where you have been continuously cranking the engine. Your problem definitely sounds like ignition timing. From your description, you have the plug wires in the correct order. I'm betting that while you were replacing points the shaft slipped out enough to change the timing. You need to find TDC at cylinder 1 (top dead center) and insure the rotor is pointing towards cylinder 1. Everything you have described makes me think ignition timing is off; this is one way that could have happened.
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Gary Dotson » Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:49 am

Tell us a bit of history, was this a running tractor when the issue came about or is this a new problem that occurred after working on it? Has the distributor been removed? The distributor, on these, can be installed in any position, perhaps the cap tower that is supposed to #1 isn’t #1 after all. If all the valves are functioning and valve clearances are at least close, I very much doubt an intake valve problem. I think the problem is right there at the distributor cap.

elmrfudd
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Sat Apr 08, 2023 8:42 am

I’m working on this for a friend who got it from his dad who just passed away recently. It did nothing when it got here. Clutch interlock switch arm was broken off, so I fabricated a new one. That’s working fine now. Was getting no fire at any plug, so I opened up the distributor and found the points spring broken in two, so points weren’t functional. Installed new distributor kit, and got spark to all plugs afterwards. I will definitely follow the advice above, with checking TDC timing with distributor on #1. Also replaced plugs with new ones. Thank you for all the great advice on pointing to the distributor as the likely culprit. Much appreciated. With family coming in for the holiday weekend, I won’t be able to get to it until at least Tuesday, but I will post updates as soon possible. Thanks again!

elmrfudd
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Sat Apr 08, 2023 12:28 pm

Well, I got the LoBoy up and running, thanks to your help from this blog! Starts and runs great, however I have another problem! The entire drive train is turning from front to back, full time, to the point I can’t even shift the transmission without grinding gears. The PTO lever behind the seat on the left is in the down/off position. I can only shift gears with the engine off, but then the wheels start creeping when I turn the engine. So everything is turning all at once, including the blades under the deck. I’m guessing there’s a clutch that needs to be released from sticking or being frozen, but not sure. Blade up and down lever on the right side of dash, PTO lever on the left behind the seat, and gear shifter in the middle in front of the seat…..No other levers visible except choke and throttle. Advice greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!

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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Eugene » Sat Apr 08, 2023 12:35 pm

The engine clutch is located under the cowling between the operator's knees. The engine clutch has a brake puck that stops the clutch from turning when the clutch pedal is depressed.

Easy fix. HamiltonBob's, advertiser at bottom of page, has the pucks and other Cub parts.

Do you have a parts manual, service manual, and operator's manual for the tractor? If not you need them.
I have an excuse. CRS.

elmrfudd
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Sat Apr 08, 2023 1:48 pm

Is that the one right below the front of the seat? I hope you're right being an easy fix, as it's been one thing after another with this tractor. I do not have a user, parts, or service manual, but thinking I can access them online. So do you think the brake puck may be worn, damaged or frozen? This LoBoy job is pretty new to me, considering I'm normally used to working on standard riding and walk behind mowers. So if you say easy fix, I'm guessing you've seen this before. Thanks!

Eugene
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Eugene » Sat Apr 08, 2023 1:57 pm

elmrfudd wrote:Is that the one right below the front of the seat?
Correct
So do you think the brake puck may be worn, damaged or frozen?
Worn out, fairly common, or needs adjustment. This is where the service manual comes in handy, with adjustment specs.
So if you say easy fix, I'm guessing you've seen this before.
Yup.
I have an excuse. CRS.

Jim Becker
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby Jim Becker » Sat Apr 08, 2023 3:01 pm

elmrfudd wrote:. . . but then the wheels start creeping when I turn the engine. . . .

That does not sound to me like a problem that can be fixed by adjusting/repairing/replacing the clutch brake pucks. The creeping behavior says something else. The main clutch is dragging. You may be able to fix that with an adjustment, maybe some lubrication. It is in the same area as the pucks, but a different problem.

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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby SamsFarm » Sat Apr 08, 2023 4:02 pm

elmrfudd wrote:Well, I got the LoBoy up and running, thanks to your help from this blog! Starts and runs great


I mighta missed it but what was the solution to the running problem?
1968 Cub Fast-Hitch

elmrfudd
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby elmrfudd » Sat Apr 08, 2023 7:05 pm

The solution to the running problem was correcting a mistake made by yours truly. After replacing the distributor components with new, I reinstalled the wires to the cap in the proper firing sequence, but one post off from the rotor position. I just rotated the wires clockwise by one post. After I had it running a little bit, and it burned off the oil I squirted into the spark plug holes to lube the upper cylinders, I rotated the distributor slightly to tweak the timing to where the engine ran smoothly. Now it starts right up each time and runs great! And by the way, I’m guessing the pucks have a technical name…..is that the same as a release lever? I lubed the dickens out of the whole clutch assembly today with a can of penetrant, but didn’t see anything break loose and free up, unless it’s so frozen it will take awhile to free up. It could be possible It could stand another good soaking. I’ll gladly take all the input I can get on this one. All I know is that I can’t drive it in full time engagement mode. Again, the LoBoy rookie wants to thank all you guys for your expertise and insight!

staninlowerAL
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Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1 is for parts), (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (2)154 Number Series Loboys, (1 is for parts), '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '47 & '49 Avery V, '53 MM BG (offset), '51 JD M (regular), '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76? Yanmar 2TR15 1500 & Bush Hog SQ42S-2 mower, '78? FORD Dexta, '86 FORD LGT14D & 48" Mower, (2)Cub Cadets & Mowers (MTD), (4) Sears Surburban's, other MTD mowers, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
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Re: LoBoy 154 coughs, but won’t start

Postby staninlowerAL » Sat Apr 08, 2023 8:18 pm

Eugene wrote:.........Do you have a parts manual, service manual, and operator's manual for the tractor? If not you need them.

The Number Series LoBoy manuals are located at the Quick links tab, top left corner of this page. :hattip: Stan
Stan in LA (lower AL)
USAF & Reserves, Reg ARMY, ARMY NG (AL)


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