Left side brake band

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Gene Rogers
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Left side brake band

Postby Gene Rogers » Mon Dec 27, 2021 3:19 pm

I am trying to install a new brake band on the left side of my 1951 cub. The band is not sitting completely straight on the drum and I was wondering if I installed the drum too far onto the shaft. I put it on as far it would go but I could bring it back out a quarter of and inch or so. Anyone have a picture of how far on it should go on. I thought I put it on exactly where I took it off.

Thanks,

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Bill V in Md
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Bill V in Md » Mon Dec 27, 2021 4:39 pm

Not sure you can see the exact location of the brake drum in this photo, but the bore of the drum is just clear of the shoulder on the differential shaft. You are somewhat constrained once you install the keyway and the set screw, so you don't have much flexibility. Since you have a 51 Cub, I assume you still have the old style finals and non-toggle brake bands as shown in this photo. The outside edge of the brake band band is flush with the outside edge of the brake drum and is held in place with the pin.

Left Final & Brake Band.jpg
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Dale Finch
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Dale Finch » Mon Dec 27, 2021 5:25 pm

I'm pretty sure you want that brake drum hard against the shoulder, then make sure that set screw is good and type along with the jam nut. Have you checked to make sure the pin is in the right direction? Seems I remember it can go either way, but maybe that is the toggle-style brakes...CRS!!! :roll:
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Gene Rogers
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Gene Rogers » Mon Dec 27, 2021 8:11 pm

I moved the brake drum out about 1/4 to 3/8 inch on the axle shaft and retightened bolt and nut, installed new brake pad and attempted to reinstall the final to the differential. (Dale, this before I saw your post) The brake pin was very loose and wobbles a lot and I could not get the brake pin into it's hole on the differential. I don't see a spacer that the brake pins fits into. I guess I lost it or it's was not there. My final and brake pad looks just the one in Bill V's earlier post. Does anyone know if I need this spacer and what it's size it?

Thanks!

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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Bob McCarty » Mon Dec 27, 2021 9:36 pm

I don't believe there was ever a spacer used there. Quite a few years ago at my Cubfest, we saw the same thing. I found a bushing that was the correct ID for the pin (maybe 5/16") at our Ace hardware. We had to enlarge the hole for the OD but it worked well. You may need another pair of hands to help get the pin into the differential. Hope that helps.
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Gene Rogers
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Gene Rogers » Mon Dec 27, 2021 10:42 pm

I think I'll skip the spacer and put the pin in without it, and yes another pair of hands would be a big help.

Thanks a lot to all those who replied !

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Bill V in Md
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Bill V in Md » Mon Dec 27, 2021 10:50 pm

Gene, it sounds like my pin is a little different than yours. I wish I had taken a photo of the pin itself, but I could not find one. I believe it is one piece, but has a short section that is a larger O.D. to hold the brake band in place at the proper location on the brake drum. At first I wasn't sure which end of the pin should be inserted into the brake band. Below is a photo of the wrong orientation, because it does not allow the brake band to be in complete contact with the brake drum. If you compare the below photo to the earlier photo, you will see what I mean.
Tractor Restoration 007.jpg
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Glen » Mon Dec 27, 2021 11:35 pm

Hi,
The Cub parts manual shows that there were 2 different brake pins used over the years.
The 1st pin had a separate spacer on it. It says it was used up to Cub serial number 18558.
Someone probably changed something if a 1951 Cub has the 1st style of pin.

A 1951 Cub has the brakes in the upper pics on the page.

http://www.farmallcub.info/manuals/cub_ ... 004-02.jpg

http://www.farmallcub.info/manuals/cub_ ... 004-03.jpg

The manual shows the spacer on the pin faces in, toward the tractor, on both sides.

The spacer keeps the brake band from moving sideways on the pin.
If the band moves sideways, the brake lining could be part way off the brake drum.

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Don McCombs
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Don McCombs » Tue Dec 28, 2021 7:15 am

Bill V in Md wrote:Gene, it sounds like my pin is a little different than yours. I wish I had taken a photo of the pin itself, but I could not find one. I believe it is one piece, but has a short section that is a larger O.D. to hold the brake band in place at the proper location on the brake drum. At first I wasn't sure which end of the pin should be inserted into the brake band. Below is a photo of the wrong orientation, because it does not allow the brake band to be in complete contact with the brake drum. If you compare the below photo to the earlier photo, you will see what I mean.
Tractor Restoration 007.jpg

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electricjake
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby electricjake » Sun Jan 02, 2022 3:16 pm

This is a great thread, I am getting ready to change the brakes on my cub and this really helps.

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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Gene Rogers » Sun Jan 02, 2022 5:07 pm

Be sure to take pictures then you won’t have to guess how it goes back on.

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Glen
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Re: Left side brake band

Postby Glen » Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:25 pm

Hi,
Welcome to the forum, electricjake.

Here is info for removing a final drive, and replacing a brake, if you need it.

Before removing parts of the Cub from the rear, be sure to put wedges in the front axle pivot.
A Cub is heavier on the left side, and they can tip over if you remove parts of them from the rear, or split them, without putting wedges at the front axle.
You will need to make the wedges from wood.
Below is a pic of the wedges.
Hammer them in tight, be sure they don't hit at the small end.
Check them some during the work, to be sure they don't come loose.
Wedges cut at a lesser angle would make more contact on the top side.

You can look in the holes in the front and rear of the final drives, using a good light, and see if the brake areas are dry.
There should be no oil where the brakes are.

The trans could have water in the oil, raising the oil level. Or the oil could be overfilled, and make the seals leak, if they leak.
The Cub operator's manual shows where the 3 transmission oil plugs are.
The oil filler plug is to the rear of the shifter.
The oil level plug is low on the left side of the trans. Fill it until oil runs out the hole.
The oil drain plug is at the bottom of the trans, visible from under the platform.
The trans holds 3 1/2 Pints of oil.
All the capacities are in the operator's manual.

If you remove a final drive to replace the brake lining, I like to replace the oil seals, if they haven't been replaced lately. There are 2 oil seals at each brake.
Basically, 1 seal on each side of the brake drum.
If one or both seals leak, it can get oil on the brake lining.

TM Tractor at the bottom of the page has lots of parts.
Below is their listings for the oil seal in the transmission, for the shaft the brakes are on.
There is a pic in the listing of where it goes.

http://www.tmtractor.com/new/df/245fp.htm

This oil seal is in the final drive, behind the brake drum.
There are pics of the final drives, and where the seal goes.

http://www.tmtractor.com/new/df/044fp.htm

TM Tractor has gaskets also.

Below is a post by Dale Finch showing removing a final drive, and repairing a brake, and replacing 1 oil seal. It doesn't show replacing the oil seal in the final drive.
I would replace both oil seals, if you are removing a final drive.
The Cub in the post has the 1st style of brake, the rod is attached to the brake band.
IH changed to the 2nd style of brake during 1953, the rod is separate from the brake band on those, and there is other linkage for the brake.
Be sure to buy parts for the right style of brake.

viewtopic.php?f=142&t=78436

The right side is more work, if you want to replace the oil seal in the trans.
You need to remove the seat post, the battery box, and loosen the platform, so the rear of the platform will lift up. Then remove the right side extension, to get to the seal.

You didn't say what year the Cub is.
Some of the Cub owner's and operator's manuals say to use 80W gear oil in the transmission and final drives.
Nowadays there is 80W-90 gear oil, you can use that.

The right final drive has the Seed Plate Drive, to run planters. It is the end of the axle that you see. It turns the same speed as the axle turns.
There is an oil seal in the cap there.

Below is a page from the 1955 Cub operator's manual, telling about it.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... e%2063.jpg

The 2nd pic below, from TM Tractor, shows the newer style of brake.

The 3rd pic shows putting the final drive on the Cub, it is the newer style of brake in the pic, it is the right side in the pic.
Be sure both ends of the brake pin go in the holes for them as you put the final drive on, it can break the casting if the pin is not in the holes, and you tighten the bolts holding the final drive on.
The 1st style of brake has a pin also.
There are 6 bolts in a circle that hold the final drive on the Cub.
There are dowel pins at the top and bottom also, the final drive may fit tight on the pins, it should be snug on the pins. If any of the pins are gone, it should be replaced, TM Tractor has new dowel pins.
Good luck. :)
Attachments
Cub wedges 2.jpg
Cub brake.jpg
Cub brake pin .jpg
Cub brake pin .jpg (35.88 KiB) Viewed 263 times


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