Engine Work - Update

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Stanton
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Stanton » Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:43 am

Dale Finch wrote:Looks like just enough rain fell to increase humidity to steaming! :|


Dale, you're exactly right. Of course living where you do, you probably get high humidity throughout the summer like we do. It's a "right of summer" to have a solid week of high, summer heat with a dose of humidity thrown in. Here's the forecast for KCMO for the week:
Capture.JPG

ricky racer wrote:I'm glad to hear you were feeling up to doing some work outside. :coffee:


Thanks, Ricky. I was too. Sure hope I have a few more good days during the next round, but doubt I do during the rest of this week.
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Clemsonfor » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:49 am

Good to hear your getting back after some things. Last time I was painting I heard that noise on my shed roof as I was mixing the last coat of paint and had just put catalyst into it. Now I was just painting a hitch haul type rack with Rust-Oleum so it wasn't a big deal. I went out and sprayed it anyway, I had it hanging so it was narrow side up. I ran to it to get a coat onto it. The vertices surfaces just marked up from the water. I took it and put it into the shed to dry. Like I said for what it was it wasn't a big deal had it been a different project I would of been more angry .

This story makes me think it always rains when you try to paint. Maybe I need to find something to paint. Some rain would be nice and the neighbor cutting hay this weekend didn't do the trick yet!

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Jim Becker » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:44 pm

Clemsonfor wrote:. . . This story makes me think it always rains when you try to paint. . . .

I had a similar experience when I was painting my Pittsburgh Field Cultivator. I was doing some individual pieces when it didn't particularly look like rain was coming. One of the parts I had just done was the Fast Hitch prong. We got a few drops of rain, including a large one that caused a splatter on top of the prong. A half inch over and it would have missed completely. Since it was on top of the prong, I thought it might get worn off anyway. I think it is still there.

This is the cultivator, although the splat isn't in the pictures.
http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=110963&p=881736

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Stanton
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Stanton » Sat Jun 18, 2022 7:47 pm

Removed tape from painted parts this morning. After sitting in a hot barn all week, I thought they'd cure nicely...they did. :D

IMG_5119.JPG
Pulling tape.

IMG_5120.JPG
Assembling the fan blade to the hub.

IMG_5121.JPG
Here's the whole gang.

IMG_5122.JPG
Put a yellow dot in the pointer/timing notch.


Thanks. :hattip:
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Stanton » Mon Jul 25, 2022 8:54 am

Since chemo has ended, I've have more energy to do some work on the Cub.

IMG_5247.JPG
Made a new rear oil retainer gasket.

IMG_5248.JPG

IMG_5249.JPG
Got the oil pump with new gasket and rear seal retainer with new seal installed.

IMG_5250.JPG
Flywheel installed.


Next will be connecting the engine to the bell housing/chasis and the front end to the engine. It'll be nice to see Nellie with all her wheels on the ground supporting herself.
:D
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby ricky racer » Mon Jul 25, 2022 2:10 pm

I'm glad you're feeling better. :big afro:
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby tst » Mon Jul 25, 2022 3:32 pm

seal the flywheel bolts as they are drilled all the way through the crank and the oil leaks back through the threads

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Glen » Mon Jul 25, 2022 5:15 pm

Hi,
Below is info about the clutch, if you need it. You probably know most of it already, but it might help others.

Some people on here prefer the old original IH clutch pressure plate to the new imported ones.
They like the quality better.

I remember someone on here replaced the clutch, and used it for a short time, and it quit working right. He looked in the hand hole, under the clutch, and 1 finger had bent down, so the clutch wouldn't release right.
He had to split the Cub, and replace the pressure plate again.

They say on here that the clutch parts TM Tractor at the bottom of the page sells are good quality.

1 of the experts on here has said that the pilot bushing, in the end of the crankshaft, doesn't need replacing if it is still good.
Measure it's ID with a dial caliper and if it looks good, it can be used again.

If you replace the pilot bushing, after putting it in the crankshaft hole, be sure to measure it's ID with a dial caliper before putting the pressure plate on the flywheel.
If the clearance is too small, the bushing needs reaming to make it bigger.

The pilot bushing ID can shrink after driving it in the hole. Then if the bushing ID is too small, and you put the Cub together, the clutch shaft won't stop turning when you push the clutch pedal down.
Then the gears grind when trying to shift them.

Below is a page from the Cub service manual, showing the running clearance for the pilot bushing, at Spline and clutch shaft.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... -05-02.jpg

If the bushing is too small, it needs reaming.

The graphite material sticks out of a new throwout bearing 5/16", they can wear down with use, and need replacing.
They have said on here to soak a new throwout bearing in light motor oil for a day or more before putting it in.
Also they have said on here, grease the throwout bearing grease fitting with cheap grease, so the oil in the grease absorbs into the graphite material.
The original bearings had a small hole at the top of them for excess grease to come out.
Grease it until grease comes out the hole, if the new bearing has the hole.

Be sure the throwout bearing holder is straight, and check it's holes, and the pin at the top of the holder for wear.
The holder should not move up and down, or side to side, so the throwout bearing is centered on the 3 pressure plate fingers.
Bend the upper part of the holder if needed, so it is out almost against the casting, and has very little side to side movement. The bearing has to be centered side to side with the 3 fingers.
TM Tractor, at the bottom of the page, has a new holder and pin, if you need them.
Their holder is for Cubs serial number 32229 and above.

The holder has to hold the throwout bearing snugly, so the top of the bearing doesn't flop down and rub on the fingers.

Turn the clutch shaft when the Cub is split and be sure it turns straight, and it's not bent.

You can use fine sandpaper and sand the flywheel and pressure plate surfaces, if you are using the same pressure plate. Clean off all sanding with a clean rag.

The hub on the clutch disc sticks out farther on one side than the other. The side that sticks out farther goes to the rear.
I would clean the rust off the splines on the shaft where the clutch disc goes, if there is any. Put on a very thin layer of grease on them. You don't want grease thrown off the shaft onto the disc lining.

Tighten the 6 pressure plate bolts that hold it on the flywheel evenly, it is loading the springs as you tighten the bolts.

The pressure plate fingers height should be 1 3/16" - 1 1/4", they recommend on here.
The fingers need to be the same height to form a flat surface for the throwout bearing to push on.
The finger height is set after the clutch is fully assembled on the flywheel.
Tighten the nuts on the finger height adjustments tight when done adjusting them, so they don't come loose.

I would put a light layer of grease in the pilot bushing, and on the end of the clutch shaft that goes in the bushing, when you put the Cub together.

If the rear crankshaft seal leaks any, when the Cub is split is a good time to replace it.
You have to remove the flywheel to replace it.
They have said on here that the oil seal sold nowadays doesn't fit well in the original seal holders, on older Cubs.
The seal is too loose in the holder.
Member tst machines used holders and puts in a slightly bigger OD oil seal in them, so the seal fits tight in the holder.
You can write him a PM, if you want info about it.
He may have an ad for them in The Vine section on here.

TM Tractor at the bottom of the page has new parts for Cubs.

When you have it together again, a 1947 Cub should have 1 3/16" of clutch pedal free play, at the top of its travel, measured at the surface where you put your foot.

Below is a page from the 1947 Cub owner's manual, showing adjusting the clutch pedal free play.
There is a pic of the clutch on the page also.
Cubs after serial number 32229 use 1" of free play, and have a different adjustment method.
The owner's or operator's manuals for those shows how to adjust it.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... age-40.jpg

All 3 pedals should have return springs under the platform, to hold the pedals up against the platform.
If the clutch pedal had no return spring, it would always go ahead, and the throwout bearing would touch on the pressure plate fingers.
The clutch pedal should move freely at it's base, sometimes the clutch pedal base gets tight from no lube. Work penetrating oil, or oil into the base if it hasn't been oiled lately.
If the pedal is free at the base, it usually pulls out of the clutch housing about 1/4", that helps to get oil into the base. There is a length the base goes into the housing to work oil into.

Below is a pic of a pressure plate, showing where to measure the finger height to, the pressure plate has to be assembled on the flywheel, not off, like the pic is.

The 2nd pic from TM Tractor shows the clutch pedal base. 2/3 of the shiny area at the right makes contact in the hole made in the clutch housing.
The 1/3 on the left of the pic sticks through the hole.
Push the pedal base back into the housing when done oiling it.
Good luck. :)
Attachments
Cub clutch 3.jpg
Cub clutch pedal.jpg

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Stanton
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Location: Lone Jack, MO

Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Stanton » Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:32 pm

tst wrote:seal the flywheel bolts as they are drilled all the way through the crank and the oil leaks back through the threads


Hadn’t thought of that.
:hattip:
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PFord
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby PFord » Thu Jul 28, 2022 11:23 am

What a FANTASTIC read! And well documented! Kinda makes me want to do a block up re-build!

Quick question though. Am I to understand that some/all of the head bolts screw down into a water jacket? If so, that will GREATLY influence which head bolts I buy this weekend!

Thank you.

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby tst » Thu Jul 28, 2022 11:38 am

yes, bolts need to be sealed and the correct length, one is 2 3/8 , the other 3 1/4 , you will find no one stocks the short one

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby PFord » Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:01 pm

tst wrote:yes, bolts need to be sealed and the correct length, one is 2 3/8 , the other 3 1/4 , you will find no one stocks the short one


LOL! Yep, that is EXACTLY what I am finding! So the choice is to buy a 2 1/2 and cut it, or just go with the OEM.

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby PFord » Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:12 pm

I guess the next question is what happens if you DON'T bottom out the bolt. What happens if I run a bolt that 1/8" too short? With the little power these engines produce I can't fathom that I'd run out of clamping force to hold back that 12HP! :)

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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby Slim140 » Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:34 pm

PFord wrote:I guess the next question is what happens if you DON'T bottom out the bolt. What happens if I run a bolt that 1/8" too short? With the little power these engines produce I can't fathom that I'd run out of clamping force to hold back that 12HP! :)

You run the risk of stripping the threads out of the hole when you torque the bolts. You want as many threads engaged as possible.
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Re: Engine Work - Update

Postby PFord » Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:58 pm

Slim140 wrote:You run the risk of stripping the threads out of the hole when you torque the bolts. You want as many threads engaged as possible.


Fair point.

At 16tpi, a 1/8" short bolt would miss 2 threads. This assumes that all threads are engaged with an OEM bolt. I haven't looked in the block to see if that's the case. We're torquing to 45ftlb. I'd have to imagine it would take a LOT of force in an iron block to strip the threads. We routinely see torque figures north of 100ftlb in other iron blocks, some closer to 200ftlb.

It's certainly a risk.


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