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Stuck in frozen mud

The Cub Club -- Questions and answers to all of your Cub related issues.
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TonyTractor
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Zip Code: 12444
Tractors Owned: 1948 Cub
1981 Simplicity 7117 Hydro
2009 John Deere LA105 (family/friends can help mow)

Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby TonyTractor » Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:17 am

The leaking is more like a drool when starting with the choke on. I cleaned the main jet, with a wire & shot of carb cleaner. So that seems like it emptied the float bowl. Is this correct? When I tried starting after that I could hear the bowl refill suction/noise (?) which I didn't notice until I cleaned the jet.
From what I can see there isn't any condensation in the tank, but that is still a possibility. I may try emptying the tank & refill as it's only half full now, but it is fresh fuel.

Battery is fully charged. Good spark on plugs, checked the distributer cap & rotor all clean, plugs had some carbon buildup so I cleaned them. Had a shop halogen aimed at carb with a tarp over night, still not starting.

It's supposed to get above freezing, should be dealing with plain old mud soon.
#1 rule of tractor maintenance or repair: a tractor is not a car.

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TonyTractor
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2019 11:04 am
Zip Code: 12444
Tractors Owned: 1948 Cub
1981 Simplicity 7117 Hydro
2009 John Deere LA105 (family/friends can help mow)

Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby TonyTractor » Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:53 am

Thanks again guys. From all the replies it seems to be a fuel issue. I have not checked the condenser & points. However, being that there is good spark would this eliminate faulty points/condenser?
#1 rule of tractor maintenance or repair: a tractor is not a car.

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SONNY
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby SONNY » Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:59 am

carefully chop the frozen ground loose around the tires. dont take much to break enough around them to make them roll.
If you have a kero. fired salamander, put it so heat goes under the tractor and in a half hour you should be running. I start a skidloader all the time in winter with one. a little 55,000 size will do the trick.
Your main problem is 6-v! --- in cold they lose most of their cranking power and cubs have to really spin over to start. thats why all of mine are changed to 12-v. Heat the tractor up and if you can get a battery charger with boost settings on it , that will start it.
let us know how you get along!

Nelson 634
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Nelson 634 » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:40 am

You mentioned it has a good spark? Having a spark on a 6 volt, it needs to be blue, not white and not yellow. As Glen has stated here many times. I can only add I have had quite a time this year with condensation in the fuel. Warm days, cold nights. Have dumped many a sediment bowl of water out. Some times multiple times. I'm thinking about putting a blanket over the gas tank.
Walter

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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Frozenstate » Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:13 am

6 volt will start your tractor in below zero conditions no problem, if everthing is in order. Using 12 volts to mask mechanical issues really isn't the best solution. Keeping your tractor in good tune, using clean fuel, and keeping your battery charged is all you need to do. I keep a float charger on my Cub, and also on my 12 volt tractors that I want to run in cold weather.
Switching to 12 volt can be a cost effective way to fix a bad generator, regulator, and poorly tuned tractor but is not necessary.
In the future, as tractors become more collectable, all original equipment will more desirable.

TonyTractor
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Tractors Owned: 1948 Cub
1981 Simplicity 7117 Hydro
2009 John Deere LA105 (family/friends can help mow)

Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby TonyTractor » Fri Dec 11, 2020 9:12 am

Nelson 634 wrote:You mentioned it has a good spark? Having a spark on a 6 volt, it needs to be blue, not white and not yellow. As Glen has stated here many times. I can only add I have had quite a time this year with condensation in the fuel. Warm days, cold nights. Have dumped many a sediment bowl of water out. Some times multiple times. I'm thinking about putting a blanket over the gas tank.


Thanks Nelson, I'm pretty sure it was a white spark. I will check again. I removed carb and cleaned it but didn't find any dirt or ice. Float is at spec. Ran some gas out of bowl. Replaced carb, no start. Going to setup an auxiliary gas with fresh fuel and give it a shot.
#1 rule of tractor maintenance or repair: a tractor is not a car.

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Don McCombs
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Don McCombs » Fri Dec 11, 2020 9:40 am

Loosen the air intake pipe from the carburetor. While attempting a start, spray some carb cleaner into the throat. If it starts, your problem Is something other than the carburetor.
Don McCombs
MD, Deep Creek Lake

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TonyTractor
5+ Years
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Tractors Owned: 1948 Cub
1981 Simplicity 7117 Hydro
2009 John Deere LA105 (family/friends can help mow)

Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby TonyTractor » Fri Dec 11, 2020 9:52 am

Thanks Don, I tried carb cleaner in the throat while attempting to start, no go. The farmer down the road said to run push it down the hill and pop the clutch. Not sure I'm ready to get stuck off my property, lol.
#1 rule of tractor maintenance or repair: a tractor is not a car.

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Don McCombs
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Don McCombs » Fri Dec 11, 2020 10:40 am

I would exhaust a few more possibilities before I attempted a drift start. Although, many times that will work when nothing else will.

You said you replaced the carburetor this past Spring. What did you replace it with?
Don McCombs
MD, Deep Creek Lake

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The best teachers are those who show you where to look, but don't tell you what to see.
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Bill
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Bill » Fri Dec 11, 2020 12:02 pm

Late to the party, but a dip stick heater has always helped me start cubs when temp is low.
Bill

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Jim in SC
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Jim in SC » Sat Dec 12, 2020 6:45 am

Just another note on the 6V system - After a couple of refreshes (a '51 Cub and a '51 H - both 6V) it came to my attention from someone much smarter than me that ANY paint left between critical metal contacts will pretty much stop 6V grounding (a typical problem in a piece by piece refresh job like mine). I went back and stripped the paint off where the generator, starter, etc. are cinched down metal to metal. It worked, and both of those tractors start fine now.
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TonyTractor
5+ Years
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Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2019 11:04 am
Zip Code: 12444
Tractors Owned: 1948 Cub
1981 Simplicity 7117 Hydro
2009 John Deere LA105 (family/friends can help mow)

Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby TonyTractor » Sat Dec 12, 2020 9:15 am

Don McCombs wrote:I would exhaust a few more possibilities before I attempted a drift start. Although, many times that will work when nothing else will.

You said you replaced the carburetor this past Spring. What did you replace it with?

I replaced it with a new IH carb from TM Tractor, expensive but it I figured it was worth going for it. I took it apart yesterday to be sure everything is clean & checked the float spec again. I checked the points also. They looked fine, no pitting, but cleaned them & set the gap to be sure they open/close.
Spark on all four plugs is definitely white, not yellow or blue. I read Glen's post on spark color, maybe the condenser is faulty.

I also tried the hand crank & temporary gas tank (with fresh gas) from old snow blower, no go.
With a full battery charge it almost starts. Temps are pretty mild past two days, so I will keep at it for while.
#1 rule of tractor maintenance or repair: a tractor is not a car.

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Glen
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Glen » Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:45 pm

Hi,
I don't remember them discussing a white spark on here.
If it won't run, the condenser or coil could need replacing.

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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby Eugene » Sun Dec 13, 2020 8:18 am

The strength of the spark is revealed in the color. A red or yellow spark is weak and probably will not spark in the cylinder. A blue or white spark is strong and has enough voltage to fight across the spark plug gap even under pressure within the cylinder.
Interned search headline.

Also several articles discussing ignition systems.
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Re: Stuck in frozen mud

Postby 1541 » Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:38 pm

On especially cold days I remember dad draining the oil out into a clean milk jug. He would set it into a warm water bath in the kitchen sink then watch a half hour of tv. After a half hour the oil was nice & warm. He poured it back into the oil fill & the motor tuned over & fired off like it was summertime. We didn’t have electric up at the old barn.
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