IH but off the cub line

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Jack Donovan
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IH but off the cub line

Postby Jack Donovan » Thu Dec 30, 2004 11:20 pm

I have a International Hit and miss, model M, that I've started to restore. I have no info on this at all and thought maybe you guy's could help me out, Where to get parts or manules or anything at all. Thanks "Jack" :wink:

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Postby Jim Hudson » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:28 am

Type in http://www.google.com then type what you searching for. I did and found this http://www.hitnmiss.com/13.htm There are lots more. And forums with folks who talk hit and miss.
Young man for work, old man for advice

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Postby 'Country' Elliott » Fri Dec 31, 2004 7:09 am

Hey Jack...Try these sourses: FOR PARTS :Ed Deiss / Hit & Miss Enterprises, 4462 Mongomery Road, Orwell, OH (440) 272-5335

For Magneto/Spark Plugs/Magneto Rebuilding:John Brillman, 2328 Pepper Road, Mt. Jackson, VA (888) 274-5562.

Web Site: Harry Matthew's http://www.old-engine.com

Hope this helps you in your restoration :D ? All the BEST! 'Country' :wink:
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Postby Dale51 » Fri Dec 31, 2004 10:05 am

Country beat me to it.
The model M is one of the the more known it is like the hercules
there are a lot of them around.
So parts are easy to come by.
If it's been broken I did it.
If its not broken wait till I touch it.

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Postby Jack Donovan » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:35 pm

Thanks alot Guy's, I new some of you would come through". I am realy in the dark here, and this will help much, I know I need a Mag- as this one is missing. It is also good to know that there not to rear, as if i can't get any parts , I might as well use it for my fishing boat anchor. Do you think that Binder Books would have any Manuls? This is quite a fun Project, and I find that our for fathers were quite the Geenuses" :Jack: :idea:

'Country' Elliott
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Tractors Owned: 1948 McCormick-Deering Farmall Cub
152 Disc Plow & Flat Belt Pulley
1971 Cub Cadet Model 73
Brinly Cultivator
Brinly #8 Moldboard Plow
1971 JD 112 Garden Tractor
1928 Economy Hit & Miss Engine
1927 David Bradley "Little Wonder" Feed Grinder
3 A.H. Patch Corn Shellers
1 A.H. Patch #1 Grist Mill
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: TN, Loudon (near Knoxville)

Postby 'Country' Elliott » Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:13 pm

Hey Jack...John Brillman will have a rebuilt magneto to fit your "M" BUT...Be sure to tell him wether it is a hit & miss, or a throtle-governed engine :? (Serial number will be helpful).

Ed Deiss at Hit & Miss will have a reproduction manual for it. If Ed doesn't have one in stock...you might try Harry Matthews web page. Someone there will sell you a copy of theirs! :wink: I doubt that Binder Books has any Hit & Miss engine stuff.

HAPPY NEW YEAR & GOOD LUCK on your restoration Jack! :D
"Save The Possums...Collect The Whole Set"
"Tennessee Sun-Dried Possum...Heaven In A Can"

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Postby Jim Becker » Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:17 pm

The M wasn't just a single model, but a whole line of engines. Be sure of which version you have and let people know when looking for parts. The first digit of the serial number indicates size:
A - 1 1/2 hp
B - 3 hp
C - 6 hp
D - 10 hp.

Some had a second letter indicating which brand of magneto was used.

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Postby Jack Donovan » Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:37 pm

Thanks Guys, You have been a Great help, I am starting to learn a few things here on this thing. The tag on engine says International, 3Hp, gas/ kerosene. It then has sr#. I don't know at this if it is a hitnmiss or a governer as Country has mentioned.
P
S. Glad to have you back on board Country. Many thanks "Jack" Will try to keep you updated

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Postby Dale51 » Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:56 pm

Jack Donovan wrote:Thanks Guys, You have been a Great help, I am starting to learn a few things here on this thing. The tag on engine says International, 3Hp, gas/ kerosene. It then has sr#. I don't know at this if it is a hitnmiss or a governer as Country has mentioned.
P
S. Glad to have you back on board Country. Many thanks "Jack" Will try to keep you updated


Can you post a pic???
If it's been broken I did it.

If its not broken wait till I touch it.

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Postby Paul B » Fri Dec 31, 2004 5:04 pm

The "M's" are throttle governed, not hit & miss.

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Postby Jack Donovan » Sun Jan 02, 2005 11:14 am

Up date on resurch" Jim is right on the "M" series, The "M's" are all the same with a few changes, They started out with Igniters, then went to spark plugs, w/Mag and changed Mag to Wilco later. Of course the head changed along with the spark plug change.
Paul is also right with it being a throttle goverend, and not a Hit n Miss.
I still haven't figured out what the difference is?
Jim B., I have some "Pic's" That I had taken, but there of it mostly apart. The "M" was froze up completly, Not one moving part would move, so the antisapation got the best of me before I got the camera" And I don't know how to post "Pic's". I see this was moved; I guess I should have started herebut I didn't think I would get any responce. I appoligise for this. Thanks guys for your help and will keep you updated if you like. "Jack"

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Postby Jim Becker » Sun Jan 02, 2005 1:01 pm

On the 3hp engines, this is the magneto application information I have:

1918-1924, "B" prefix - International low tension type "L" rotary mag.
1922(or '23?)-1932, "B" prefix - American Bosch high tension type FX1 mag. (yes, overlap with IH mag)
1924-1937(or '36?), "BW" prefix - Wico high tension type "EK" oscillating mag.

There were changes to the Wico mag in '29.

This list was published in '38, so the list may not be complete.

The B and BW engines had separate runs of serial numbers.

The years in parens with ? are from the parts breakdowns. The other are from the serial number list, all in the same Parts Catalog.

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Postby Paul B » Sun Jan 02, 2005 1:23 pm

Basically, a hit & miss engine will fire, and then the exhaust valve will be held open and let the engine coast along until the speed slows down enough that the governor will allow the exhaust valve to close, and then the engine will fire and begin the process all over again. The more load on the engine, the quicker the process will repete.

A throttle governed engine will fire on every power stroke, with the govenor controlling the fuel so to speak. A throttle governed engine will run smoother and at a more constant speed which made it better for jobs that required a steady or even speed, such as pulling a generator, some lineshafts, etc.

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Postby Jack Donovan » Sun Jan 09, 2005 8:48 am

Thanks guy's I talked to the previous owner the other day and he said it was "Green"
I was also picking up a cub engine that i just bought yesterday, and the guy had "H" model like mine only smaller . 1 1/2 HP. It was complete and I got to see that I was missing a quite a few things. His was "Green" also and had the wilco mag/spark plug. So his was a little newer. Still was great to see only if i had brought my camra"
Thanks "Jim" The low tension type "L" is what I'll need.

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Postby beaconlight » Sun Jan 09, 2005 9:03 pm

During WWII my dad was at Tyndall field, Panama City Fl. My mom picked up the 4 boys and we moved to an abandoned beach colony near the field. I remember the engine on the well pump, it filled the community tank. It went bang chuga chuga chuga bang chuga chuga ETC. You could hear it a long ways of. There was no muffler. Just a piece of 1 in pipe, an elbow and another pipe and out the wall of the pump house.
From what you say i guess that was a hit and miss??? We lived there quite a while and I can still hear that thing as i type this. As I think back Mom had some guts. I was 10 Bob was 9 and the twins were 14 months. She hauled us to the train in Penn Station NY and off we went.
Changed trains in Savanna and Dothan Alabama. What had been a fancy resort reverted to a palmeto wasteland. Man did Bob and i enjoy it. But that another long story.

Thanks for bringing many happy thoughts flooding through my memory.

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