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Three cheers for Australia

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David D. smith
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Three cheers for Australia

Postby David D. smith » Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:03 pm

HOW COULD THIS BE SAID ANY BETTER? WHERE ARE OUR LEADERS??



Oh, man! this falls under the heading of "DAMN! I wish I'd said that!"



The Aussies have got the right idea. Now, we need to spread this word far and wide.



Fair dinkum, Mate!




Three Cheers for Australia!



Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.



A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown.



Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state and its laws were made by parliament.
"If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you," he said on national television.



"I'd be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia, one the Australian law and another the Islamic law, that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that's a better option," Costello said.



Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country.
Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off".



"Basically, people who don't want to be Australians, and they don't want to live by Australian values and understand them, well then they can basically clear off," he said. Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques.



AMERICA and Canada..... ARE YOU LISTENING?







------------------------------------------------------------------------
------ Australia- The Right to Leave Our Country - YOU Have the right...................the right to leave !



After Sydney not wanting to offend other cultures by putting up Xmas lights.



After hearing that the State of South Australia changed its opinion and let a Muslim woman have her picture on her driver's license with her face covered.
This prompted this editorial written by an Australian citizen.
Published in an Australian newspaper.



Quote:



IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.



However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia.



However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.



This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.



This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language!



Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture.



We will accept your beliefs and will not question why, all we ask is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.



If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.



We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means keep your culture but do not force it on others.



This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this.



But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, "THE RIGHT TO LEAVE".



If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here.
You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.



Pretty easy really, when you think about it. I figure if we all keep passing this to our friends (and enemies) it will also, sooner or later get back to the complainers, lets all try, please.



Thank you
Dave <*)))><

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Postby 400lbsonacubseatspring » Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:47 pm

I don't think there was ever a question that our Aussie ( and Kiwi for that matter) bretheren are a more practical people than we here in the US.

Likewise, our Canadian bretheren usually seek higher moral ground.

The character of the USA is that we act hypocritically, and claim to be both moral and practical, but in reality, our only actions fall into the cloak and dagger category. We speak of doing the right thing, only to deport people for no apparent reason in the middle of the night. That is our way. I'm not sure we can change it.

Actually, we act a lot like the UK, where it seems the right for minority groups to behave badly was somehow written into the fine print in the Magna Carta.

Perhaps somewhere, written into one of the ammendments to our constitution, there is language permitting similar action, written in such a way as to confound the average reader, but is clearly visible to foreigners and legal authorities.

If that is not the case, you can be sure it will be included in the ammendment that will be drafted, ultimately, for gun control.

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Australia

Postby LiL' Red » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:11 pm

Although I don't agree with many of the Aussie political viewpionts, I certainly applaud their position on this one. I just hope they follow through with it.

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Postby Don McCombs » Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:20 pm

With my sincerest apologies to the Australians that I have known and to the ones who contribute to this forum, I seriously doubt that the Australian government will follow through on this threat. After all, the liberal Australian government has put into place one of the most restrictive gun control laws in any democratic nation. Can the thought police be far behind the gun police? :cry:
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Postby W6NZ » Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:45 pm

I applaud John Howard for his statement I sure hope he acts on it. He is saying what many Kiwis are saying here in New Zealand. We are proud of our nation as many Aussies are proud of their country.
If immigrants or the like don't like it , they can go back to where they came from.

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Postby Rudi » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:25 am

I wasn't going to say much on this cause it is one of my favourite Image topics, and I could go on for hours on end. But it is getting to me in an intellectual way, and I just gotta add my two coppers to the discussion, for whatever it is worth.

Also, just a reminder... as interesting a topic as this is, we must continue to ensure that we keep honouring all our fellow members opinions. We must keep this thread in perspective and not go off on rants etc. If it gets out of hand, it will have to be locked down, so we must.. and I include myself and I believe the other mods will agree, we must be mindful of our brothers and sisters. We cannot enflame, but we can discuss.




Before I get to far into it.. a couple points to remember.

1. My mother's family has been here in Canada since the second voyage of Jacques Cartier, so aside from the First Nations (of which many are members of Mom's ancestral family), her family can pretty much call themselves Canadian, and have no arguments.

2. My father emigrated to this country after serving his country in WW2. Well, if you call a 13 year old boy being drafted at the point of a rifle, serving, then I guess that is what it was.... so being a 1st generation Canadian on that side of the coin, I have a certain insight to this immigrant thing.

3. I stood up and was counted. I served my country for better or for worse. If one believes in freedom, if one believes in the tenents of our society, one can do no less. Be it in uniform, be it as a civil servant, be it as a good and law-abiding God Fearing citizen.. one can do no less.

Now, when my Dad came to Canada, he came with his heritage, his belief structure, his faith and his health. He also came to this country with a dollar and 15 cents..... His faith and belief structure was common to all of us because of our common Teutonic descent... {yes, most Europeans are Teutons from way back.. the Franks, the Gauls, the Saxons and yes my dear Brit members of the family, you too are Teutons -- that is what Anglo-Saxon means.... all have the same gene pool, all have the same heritage.}

However, he came to this country with a belief that he was given a second chance at building a decent life. One without totalitarian government, one without bombs falling around his ears, one without starvation and misery. He came here with the belief that once he landed, he MUST become Canadian, he MUST adhere to Canada's political, legal and societal systems. This he did. In fact, he was so carried away with it, he never even taught his wife nor his children his native tongue. We had to learn it the hard way... by ourselves... and none of us are exactly fluent in German anymore...

He came to this country to work hard, be productive, be a positive contributing member of Canadian society and to not be a drain or a hardship. When he was electrocuted back in 64... my mom who had 5 kids at the time and number 6 on the way, had no means of providing for us.. so unfortunately we had to depend on Relief/Welfare. My Dad was so outraged at this perceived drain on the country, that when he was well enough he PAID BACK EVERY DIME that we as a family were given. Nuts, but this is what he did.

In my experience, most immigrants from Europe especially acted this way. It didn't matter if they were German, Dutch, Italian, Lithuanian, Croatian, Ukrainian, Hungarian and the list goes on. I do not recall ever knowing an immigrant who did not work hard, did not contribute, did not try to become part of the fabric of Canada.

We never had these kind of problems until really the late 60's and early 70's. By the mid 80's all of a sudden we have had all inclusive minority rights, with the majority all of a sudden being restricted in what they could do. This is not only wrong, it is absurd. Democracy means that the majority rules... period. One person, one vote... quite simple really. The men and women who paid the price for Conferderation in Canada, and the Fathers of Independance in the US understood this... maybe we need to re-evaluate what they wrote.... :!: :idea: :?: :?: :shock:

I think the statement: One Nation under GOD is common to most Democracies.. at least the US, Canada, Australia, I presume New Zealand, Britain, and a raft of others.... I am not a constitutional expert - sadly..... not even competent.

If you emigrate from your homeland to Canada, Australia, New Zealand or the US, then you are choosing to emigrate to a country that is in most cases better off than the one you were born in. Given that fact, and that these countries you emigrate to, are offering a better chance at a good life, then what right do you have to demand that these countries bend to YOUR will :?: :?: That is one of the reasons why you probably left in the first place :!: :!: :!:

Another thought... we are always taught -- all of us in the Christian world, that when we go to a Muslim nation we should be aware of the rules/traditions/customs/laws of Islam (Sharia), and that we should honour and we should ensure that we do not in any way cause problems. Western women must even observe the same practices as Islamic women... fair -- NOT -- understandable YES... as the old saying goes.. When In Rome, Do As The Romans Do :shock: :)

And this applies to all hopeful immigrants... as well as our friends from the Muslim world -- same thing is required of YOU! You MUST accept our rules/traditions/customs/laws. If you cannot, then do not Emigrate to our country:!: It is not your right to demand that the rest of the world adhere or convert to your belief system. It is not your right to demand that the rest of the world accept your mores, your laws, your political system. It is up to you to co-exist peacefully with ours.

I am a Christian who lives in a country founded on Christian principles, and this is what I believe:

1] Also they teach that men cannot be justified before God by their own strength, merits, or works, but are freely justified for
2] Christ's sake, through faith, when they believe that they are received into favor, and that their sins are forgiven for Christ's sake, who, by His death, has made satisfaction for our sins.
3] This faith God imputes for righteousness in His sight. Rom. 3 and 4.


That is my belief. It is incontrovertible, and it is what the Church has been teaching for nigh on 2,000 years.

I believe in the God of Abraham... as do the children of Israel, both of the Old Testament and the New Testament. And I am not going to get into semantics or any other discussion on who the Children of Israel are... God has already spoken to that.. Genesis pretty much clarifies that.

Christians, Jews and Muslims all claim to believe in the God of Abraham.

Maybe what we all need to do, is revisit the Old Testament and start living our lives according to God's Will and not Man's interpretation of what God may or may not have said..

So yes, I agree with my Australian cousins If you cannot accept our society as it is... don't bother coming and if you are already here, please Feel Free To LEAVE -- next plane, or boat or whatever you rode into town on... just leave...

-- oh, my cousin Gerhardt and his family are educators in Australia and his grandfather was a Evangelical Catholic missionary to the islands in that area.
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Postby 400lbsonacubseatspring » Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:45 am

Rudi wrote:Maybe what we all need to do, is revisit the Old Testament and start living our lives according to God's Will and not Man's interpretation of what God may or may not have said..



Well, there goes the pork industry............... :shock:

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Postby Rudi » Tue Mar 14, 2006 1:13 pm

Tom:

Well, there goes the pork industry............... :shock:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Nah, I don't think so...... :roll: :lol:

Remember what is in the Old Testament -- it is the promise of the one who is to come, and the promise has been fulfilled. He has already come and paid the price.

so the pork industry is safe ... at least in my house. I like the other white meat :!: :wink: :lol:

What I meant was that maybe everybody should take head to what HE said, which not only included the 10 commandments and the law, but also the promise which would be fulfilled, and what that promise meant. It has been the devisive point for the last 2,000 years.

And of course there is the problem of contextuality. When comments are taken out of context, that is where problems begin. One must always strive to keep things in context.

Cutting and pasting bits and pieces of the Bible, or the Quran or whatever book one wishes to use as an illustration, can lead to much misunderstanding and has over time.

Fire and Brimstone preaching comes to mind.... we can all be guilty of this at times, but it is imperative that we keep contextuality in mind when discussing topics that can lead into deeper waters.
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Postby jim turner » Tue Mar 14, 2006 8:06 pm

Rudi I agree with almost everything you said except for one thing and correct me if I am wrong but here in the states we fought for freedom of certian things one of which is the right to worship as we please, however one shouldn't invoke their ideas and beliefs on another, Jut my opinion .
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Postby Ron L » Tue Mar 14, 2006 8:13 pm

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Postby 400lbsonacubseatspring » Tue Mar 14, 2006 8:39 pm

There was a time, friends, when the USA was considered "the great melting pot". It got its name from generations of non-english speaking immigrants coming here, and assimilating. Sure, there were clusters of ethnic groups in large cities, but all in all, they assimilated.

Somewhere along the line, in the last 20 years, someone blew out the fire, I think, because people just don't "melt" like they used to. We have become a bi-lingual country here, incase no one has noticed. I find that, firstly, sad, and secondly, unnecessary, as all of our ancestors before us were forced (sometimes quite literally) to assimilate the language and culture, and now, suddenly, latino's are so "special" that they are above the need to assimilate. All things considered, at the very least it is both an insult to their intelligence, and an insult to the millions of non-english speaking immigrants that passed through Ellis Island.

I regards to Muslim immigrants. I have a friend who owns a grocery outlet. He and his family are from Syria. They are very nice people, all of them. His wife, sister, and Mother all dress by Sharia law, but "Joe" , as he likes to be called, has 3 young daughters, who do not.

Believing that honest curiousity between cultures never did anyone any harm, one day I asked Joe if his daughters would dress in veils, robes, and sandals, as their beautiful mother does. He responded "No, no way. My wife wants to do that, not me. I want them to be modern women, go to college, have careers. Of course I would like them to marry an Islamic husband, but that is up to them. I just want them to be happy."

I then judged Joe to be a good and decent man and father, and he never once proved me wrong.

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Postby W6NZ » Tue Mar 14, 2006 9:11 pm

As it has been said before, "when in Rome do as the Romans do". You don't need to be a rocket scientist to know your fate if you tried to 'change' the Eastern way of life.

RonL, luv the pic. 8)

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Postby Mac from NS » Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:21 pm

Well I guess I've got lots to say on this subject, but I would just be repeating.
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Postby ljw » Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:35 pm

I’ve been reading the various posts on this subject and everybody is right. On this topic you can pick and choose, cut and paste, etc. to satisfy your position. And that is our problem, and we do have a problem. I believe in God. I believe that we were created with good reason, what, I don’t know. I firmly believe that life is too precious and wonderful for it not to be a divine work. Look at the galactic slideshow that W6NZ turned us on to. I’m afraid that life is bigger than us, and maybe bigger than religion.
Don’t you think it’s curious that people of religion who were born in to, or that lived in a particular area of the world, followed that same religion as their religion of choice? And they would take that faith to the grave? Literally.
People wonder why other cultures are hesitant to assimilate into the American culture. Where the young people disrespect the women and the elderly. I can be reproached for writng this. People will say “That’s not the way we are! No not completely, but it happens much too often and getting worse.
In saying all that, it makes sense(?) that it reinforces our need to stay flexible in our mind, and other body parts, to accept change as best we can. Throughout history, many terrible and cruel actions have turned out to the benefit of mankind.
I believe that the words “norm”, right and wrong, average, typical, etc. are used to describe something that cannot be described. What was wrong yesterday may not be wrong tomorrow. Or wrong in the next county. Etc., etc., etc. Each of us needs to look within and find the path that is right for us. And to accept differing opinions as long as it causes no harm to me and mine.
Will it happen? Maybe in a million years, but I can wait.

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Postby Rudi » Wed Mar 15, 2006 6:32 am

Jim:

Rudi I agree with almost everything you said except for one thing and correct me if I am wrong but here in the states we fought for freedom of certian things one of which is the right to worship as we please, however one shouldn't invoke their ideas and beliefs on another, Jut my opinion .


Not too much different. We also fought for freedom of religion. If we hadn't we would all be Anglican or Episcopalian to y'all Stateside... Canada is chock full of different faiths... or whatever ya wanna call it. Remember the part about my Mom's family. The French in me fought the Brits and lost on the Plains of Abraham. However, they won in more ways than they lost......

I take it you are refering to my use of the term Evangelical Catholic?
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