New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

IH CUB Lo-Boy Series - 154, 184, 185 Forum -- Questions and answers to all of your Lo-Boy related issues.

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shibby
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New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby shibby » Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:32 pm

Hi everyone, I just signed up after purchasing a 74-76 Lo Boy 185 about a week ago.

This is my first 'real' tractor (other than garden tractors), and I'm kind of worried. I have a LOT of top soil to move/spread at my mother's home, so I bought this tractor after seeing it on Craigslist. It has a Johnson Loader attached.

I had to do a few things to it right off the bat, which I knew. I put a new Chinese carb on it (works great, surprisingly), new battery, and rigged up a new throttle assembly/cable from a junk lawnmower. One of the lift cylinders on the loader leaks pretty bad. I've been trying to find a rebuild kit for it, but looks like someone replaced the original cylinders with larger units, so I have no idea what they are.

Anyway, the major problem I'm having now is that the tractor barely moves. It seemed fine the first couple days, but after scooping about 6 buckets of dirt up and dumping them, the tractor barely moves in any gear now. If there's a slight incline or anything, it struggles to get over it from a stop. Once moving it's 'ok', but when first starting out, it struggles. Obviously this has also made it almost impossible to scoop up dirt now. It just doesn't have the power to push through it.

Do you think I fried the clutch? It would always grind gears when putting it into gear if the engine was cold. Once warmed up, it was fine. As I read more and more around the internet, it seems to me that these things weren't really made for doing 'hard work' like loading top soil and such. Is that true? Are they really just a big lawnmower? I'm really kind of bummed. I like the tractor and have enjoyed working on the little things over the past week, but if I fried the clutch already after only 6 buckets of dirt, then maybe I bought the wrong machine?

Should I just replace the clutch disc? Do all components of the clutch need to be replaced? I'm really short on money now after purchasing it and the other parts, so hopefully I can just replace the disc itself. And if the clutch is the culprit, is there any way to mod/beef them up?

Thanks for ANY help you guys can give. I really don't know anything about these so any help is greatly appreciated. I'm sure I'll have more questions in the future also.

Thanks! :help:

outdoors4evr
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby outdoors4evr » Tue Jun 11, 2019 6:04 am

There is a bolt in the driveshaft that probably has sheared off. Remove the tunnel and get a grade 8 bolt of the same diameter with a lock nut (the kind with a nylon insert) and cut off any remaining bolt so that there are no extra threads after it is tightened. (use a dremel or a hacksaw) There isn't a lot of space where the bolt is and the extra length can catch if left long.

The clutch probably needs some adjustment so it won't grind, but I wouldn't go replacing the clutch plate just yet. Post one more time so that you can take a look at the manuals and adjust the clutch first.

As for the "Big Lawnmower" you will probably hear that idea by some, but when used within their design, these machines can do a lot of good work.
184 w/ Creeper & 3-Point
IH 3160a Mower
IH Model 15 Tiller
IH-54 Blade

Eugene
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby Eugene » Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:03 am

Lot of questions.

Leaking hydraulic cylinder. Remove the cylinder, open it up. Most likely only needs an O ring or two. O rings are available at any tractor dealership and probably the local hardware store. Usually an inexpensive fix, parts only, if you do the work.

Clutch has a brake (pucks) on the back side to stop the clutch disk from turning when pedal depressed. Either an adjustment or purchase new ones.

I own a 154, it's a nice lawn mower and pretty good for light work. Don't think the tractor was designed for robust farm work. That's my opinion. But then I own larger farm tractors and a couple of skid steers.

Good thing, they are not hard to work on and parts are still available.
I have an excuse. CRS.

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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby Stanton » Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:28 am

Welcome!

Take some time and read through a few threads to acquaint yourself with the Forum:

After your 2nd post on the Forum, you'll have access to the all the free PDF Manuals. They are located via "Quick Links" in the upper left corner of your screen. Hit that and a pull-down appears where you'll find "PDF Manuals". Through that link, you'll be able to download an Owner's Manual (very strongly recommended) and any service manuals that interest you. You'll be able to familiarize yourself with your new-to-you Cub more quickly. Implement Manuals are also available.

Might also enjoy reading through this thread: What to do with a Cub you just brought home

Glad you joined us.
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby mozer71 » Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:43 pm

I think it has been overloaded. Something has to give. The 185 is more similar to the 154 and if people put loaders on them, so be it but not me.
I don't see they were built near serious farm tractors or industrial tractors. I'm happy to crawl over things and mow at different levels, on the fly. We can't do that with smaller garden tractors. It fills a particular niche in lawn maintenance. It costs a lot of money to have equivalent work done with larger machines with tow-behind decks and no where as nimble as ours.

shibby
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby shibby » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:23 am

Thanks so much everyone for the replies! :)

As for the bolt that shears off in the driveshaft.. if that happened, would it even move at all? I would think it wouldn't. Is the original bolt weak? Will it just happen again? I guess I'll have to open 'er up and see exactly what's going on in there.

Yea I definitely have to take the cylinder apart and get the old pieces out to match them up. Never did one before but from what I've read/watched, it doesn't look too awfully hard. Now I just need some free time to do it. lol

Thanks so much for the info on the manuals and such, I definitely need to check them out. That's pretty awesome that they're available here!

I get so much conflicting info when reading about the Lo Boys. Some people say they can definitely work, some say they should just be left to lawn mowing. I really don't know what to think. I didn't know anything really about tractors, but I figured if it had a loader on it, that it could easily handle scooping up top soil. :/

Thanks again everyone, I really appreciate the help! :)

outdoors4evr
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby outdoors4evr » Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:46 am

The broken bolt in the driveshaft is probably missing the ends of the bolt, but the middle is probably still in there and providing enough friction to move on flat surfaces. Finding the bolt and driving it out will be a pain, but pretty sure you will find it. There is also a keyway that could be sheared if you have a creeper. (Not sure if you have that option).
As for the work that a numbered lowboy can do, take a look at some of the brochures.
Image Image
Image Image
Image Image
Image

Regarding the loader, I've never used a loader on a numbered lowboy. I have used a 3-point bucket to move some dirt around. I found this to be very capable even with a full bucket.
[img]http://photos.cubfest.com/albums/userpics/18687/normal_184-3PointBucket2Resized.jpg[/img
Image

I used to own a Model 50 snowthrower, but found it very difficult to use. Steering is very difficult with such a heavy weight on the front. I expect a loader to have similar challenges. The snowthrower was single stage so it didn't move the snow far enough out of the way. Perhaps the McKee 2-stage blower would not have this issue. I sold the Model 50 snowthrower and bought a walk behind 2-stage blower.
Image Image
184 w/ Creeper & 3-Point
IH 3160a Mower
IH Model 15 Tiller
IH-54 Blade

BigBill
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby BigBill » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:38 am

Don’t underestimate what these numbered tractors can do.

The little brother cub cadet.
Fact,
My neighbor was getting 3 yards of fill with each dump truck load. I went over there with my cc70 new 8hp with the snowplow. I leveled off each load while the truck went for another, everyone laughed at me when I went over there, they weren’t laughing when the little tractor was pushing dirt.

I used a cc147 with fel to move dirt to the back of my property. That little bucket can do damage once you get the rythem down.

Tilling it’s nice riding a tiller instead of walking.

If these little tractors can do work how about the int154/185/184’s?

With my int154 mower it’s a nice smooth ride cutting grass, plowing dirt fixing the driveway.

These numbered machines can do it all. I like the live pto with the clutch. My local mower repair shop calls them a mowing machine.

To me the fcub lacks what it could of been it’s a cultivator, a seeder on the farm. If it had a live pto. I needed a super A not a fcub.
I'm technically misunderstood at times i guess its been this way my whole life so why should it change now.

BigBill
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby BigBill » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:51 am

I noticed that the PO put a threaded bolt in the clutch flywheel and the bolt wears out. We need to come up with the correct shoulder bolt even if it’s metric it needs to be a tight fit.
You will know long before this bolt shears by the rattle coming from the clutch area. The shear strength is more than this application requires it’s over kill so the pin should last. The machinists handbook has all this info.

My number 3 int 154 the clutch was slipping. I seen one broken clutch spring but when I removed the clutch it had two broken springs. I was pushing dirt with one clutch spring with the creeper in low. It didn’t slip in low/low.

We got into the shear strengths with the pins used in the Crosby hammer connecting links on lifting chains to lift 25ton machine parts, were talking 3/8” diameter hardened pins with 5/8” chain.

My fcub is sitting here with a broken drive shaft. It broke at the tranny seal where the square edge is where the shaft changes diameter. By the “engineering to win book” the common practice is to have a radious in that corner rather than a square corner, upon inspection I can see two breaks. One it broke years ago but the center section held it together, the finally the center section finally cracked too.

It’s too bad that IH didn’t engineer all the fine points from the fcub and int 154/185/184 into one tractor. Think out of the box. :surrender:
I'm technically misunderstood at times i guess its been this way my whole life so why should it change now.

shibby
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Zip Code: 10918

Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby shibby » Fri Jun 14, 2019 2:35 pm

Thanks again to everyone for the replies! I need all the help/info I can get! lol


I took off the cover today, but I don't see anything sheared off. Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong spots, I don't know. The driveshaft seems to spin just fine when the engine is running, and when I depresss the clutch, it takes a good 10 seconds for everything to stop turning. I took some video of it running while depressing/releasing the clutch.. I'll upload it to YouTube later and provide a link for anyone interested.

How exactly does one adjust the clutch? Is it the threaded rod/nuts right on the top? I tried adjusting that in and out both ways a little, but nothing changed. I'm used to motorcycle clutches, installed/adjusedt many of them, but I don't really understand this one. I'm stuck in the middle of my yard right now because it can't make it up the slightest incline. :(

Any help, as usual, is greatly appreciated!

shibby
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:14 pm
Zip Code: 10918

Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby shibby » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:32 am

Hey guys, sorry for the delay. I realized shortly after this that the clutch is adjust below. I haven't gotten a chance to tinker with it yet since it rains EVERY SINGLE DAY. lol

Quick question though.. I searched but really couldn't find a clear answer (probably just me). Anyway, what should these tractors be idling at, and what is the max operating RPMs they should be run at?

Thanks!

outdoors4evr
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Re: New to the forum, and a 185. Need lots of help!

Postby outdoors4evr » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:35 am

See the service manual for the 154 for instructions on adjusting the clutch. (The 154, 185, and 184 are all represented in the service manual)
The service manual also lists the specifications for the tractors. All these #'s are plus or minus 25 rpm. For the 185:
Low idle 600 rpm
High idle 2510 rpm
Rated Load 2300 rpm (measured with an implement like a mower deck running)


Note: The PTO does not turn at engine speed. I use one of these tachometers on the PTO.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stewart-Warner ... 3805784753

If measuring RPM's from the PTO, use these numbers:
Low idle 390 rpm
High idle 1970 rpm
Rated Load 1800 rpm (measured with an implement like a mower deck running)
184 w/ Creeper & 3-Point
IH 3160a Mower
IH Model 15 Tiller
IH-54 Blade


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