Farmall M hydrualic delima

Farmall M, Super M, 400, 450 & 560 Tractors, 1939-1963

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Farmall M hydrualic delima

Postby dirt devil » Sat Dec 08, 2007 12:29 pm

I am trying to set up the M with a snow plow. As the PO already had the brackets set up, all I had to do is put on the plow. My issue is that when I lower the plow oil will pour out the breather. Now they made a exention on the breather which I think is wrong. But they also used a two way cylinder to lift the plow.

It is set up with factory remote hydrualics. Now everyone is saything that there is not enough storage to do this but I say there is since it was used to lift land plows and other hydrualic attachments in the field so why would I have an issue for one lift cylinder?

I am wondering if in the old days they used a one way cylinder instead of a two way? Also I am not sure how it should be properly plumbed up as I am not familar with it.

So with that does anyone have any pics of how it should be plumbed up properly?

Thanks Dave
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Postby Jim Becker » Sat Dec 08, 2007 12:42 pm

What size cylinder are you using? The originals were one-way but not very big diameter.
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Postby dirt devil » Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:05 pm

Jim

I am guessin but would say about a 2" bore and 1 1/2 rod.

Pics coming soon.

Dave
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Postby dirt devil » Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:19 pm

Here are a couple pics of the set up. Is it supposed to return through the breather port?

Dave

Image

Image

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Image
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Postby Don McCombs » Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:29 pm

Hey Dave, do I see something green, with yellow wheels, hiding back there under the blue tarp? :D
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Postby dirt devil » Sat Dec 08, 2007 1:58 pm

Don that would be a lonely JD B that is beside a H and a SC. Just to the right is the rear tire to Bert. :D

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Postby Steve Butram » Sat Dec 08, 2007 5:33 pm

Are you sure you have all of the air out of the system. Or you may be returning the oil too fast for the system to drain
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Postby dirt devil » Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:03 pm

Steve

After doing some more thinking and looking at it I think that the issue is where the oil is being returned. If I could get it so that the oil would return below the level instead of on top of it, it would work. What I am thinking is that when it returns the oil on top of the air it burps the oil out until the air and oil can share the same passage and then it will settle down. So with that being said I think that I am going to need another tank to help raise the oil level.

Also on the belly pump there are two ports on the left side of the tractor, what are the functions of these to ports? Is one a return and one supply?

Thanks Dave
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Postby Jim Becker » Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:38 pm

The cylinder size shouldn't be a problem. Maybe dumping oil from the cylinder plus the flow from the pump all going into the reservoir at once is too much. You have a 2-way cylinder, any reason to not hook it up that way? If you are going with a one-way setup, why are you using the remote valve? Just using the built-in one-way valve should take care of the lifting.

The one pipe on the right and 2 on the left are all one-way outputs from the built-in valve.
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Postby dirt devil » Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:27 am

Jim

the only reason that I am trying to use what I have is just that, this is how the PO set it up and am using what he left on the tractor.

Also when you ask why don't I hook the two way cylinder up, I thought that is how the PO has it set up. I am not sure about the ports on the remote valve so I don't know if it is set up right or not. If you could give me a breif education on the remote valve that would be great.

Also how would I pumb it up if I was going to use a one way cylinder and the built in valve?

Thanks Dave
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Postby KETCHAM » Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:29 am

Good luck Dave.I'm watching this post too!!I hope to have my cultivators on in the spring.Jim thanks at RPRU for telling me which ones they were!!Mine will be a lot simplier to hook up ,I hope!!! You are almost to 501 I see.Think after this you might desereve it!!!Good luck!!!Kevin :D :D :twisted:
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Postby WKPoor » Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:03 pm

Here is the deal. I've had a couple of the OEM 2way setups. The aux. valve allows porting to both sides of a 2way cylinder. Any reurn fluid then must be returned into the breather/filler port. Use the R/H supply port to the valve as that one is not delayed. There are 2 versions of the liftall. The early one is about 550lbs. and the later 750-800 lbs but with reduced clearances can be brought up to a little over 1000lbs. Any system with 2way cylinders is not volume critical as you are just trading places with the fluid in the cylinder/s. Something in your pics looks fishy as the valve has an inlet and 2 outlets, no tee should be there. and with the valve mounted in the return that where the return oil goes. Easy sytem.
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Postby dirt devil » Sun Dec 09, 2007 9:22 pm

WKpoor as you have discribed the plumbing the right side port to the valve and then the two out ports to the each side of the cylinder then the return is through the bottom of the valve and then in the breather port. That is how this system is set up. So if this is done right then why am I getting oil out the breather everytime I try to use the cylinder up or down.

Now with the valve mounted in the return do I still want to try and have the breather there or should I plug it off?

Also I am a little confused as to which tee is fishy looking to you? Could you please explain.

Thanks for the help Dave
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Postby KETCHAM » Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:14 am

Congrats on your 501 post!!!!!! :{_}: :{_}: :{_}: Kevin
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Postby WKPoor » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:05 am

I studied the pictures again and realized what I thought was a tee with a hose is not. I'm wondering now if the input port is being used as an outlet. I don't currently have that valve as I sold the last one last yr. However I might have a manual that shows how to plumb it. If I find it I will get back to you.
The 2 way cylinder must have been used because they already had it however it can be used as a one way by just installing a filter breather on one side or the other. In that application there is no reason to have it 2 way other than to use the other side to hold the fluid which is what should be happening in a 2 way circuit. Normally reservoir volume is only crititcal in 1 way applications.
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