Farmall 450 vs M,SM,SMTA

Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:32 am

I've got a Farmall 450 with quick hitch/3 pt. conv., TA, and all the other goodies of a SMTA. Of course, I lament the fact that if I were to sell it, it would bring nowhere near what a SMTA, for instance would bring. I guess that gets back to collectibility. I guess many more people grew up on an M than a 450, they only made 'em for 3 years. That must be why the letter series tractors are more collectible. The 450 is the evolution of the M as it went M, SM, SMTA, SMTA II, 400, then 450. Anyhow, I don't guess it really matters as I don't plan to sell the old 450 anyway!!

Re: Farmall 450 vs M,SM,SMTA

Mon Jan 29, 2007 9:13 pm

trentm71 wrote:I've got a Farmall 450 with quick hitch/3 pt. conv., TA, and all the other goodies of a SMTA. Of course, I lament the fact that if I were to sell it, it would bring nowhere near what a SMTA, for instance would bring. I guess that gets back to collectibility. I guess many more people grew up on an M than a 450, they only made 'em for 3 years. That must be why the letter series tractors are more collectible. The 450 is the evolution of the M as it went M, SM, SMTA, SMTA II, 400, then 450. Anyhow, I don't guess it really matters as I don't plan to sell the old 450 anyway!!


What is a SMTA II?

Mon Jan 29, 2007 9:45 pm

Brett - I believe the stage 2 supers had live hydraulics.

Mon Jan 29, 2007 9:53 pm

Bigdog wrote:Brett - I believe the stage 2 supers had live hydraulics.


I know that! :lol: I just meant what's a stage 2 Super MTA? Didn't all SMTA's have live hrdraulics? :roll:

Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:11 am

I've never heard of a SMTA stage II either. There was stage II M's battery was moved live hyd. disk brakes to name a few.

Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:44 am

No such-a-thing as a Super MTA II. There were what were known as "stage II Super M's," which was a Super M with live hydraulics. A stage I Super M has the old belly pump, like the M. I think technically a Super MTA was a "stage III." Keep in mind I don't think IH really sold them as stage I, II, III, that was an internal thing to keep the models separate. Also remember they did make Super MTA's without TA's! If so, it was STILL a Super MTA. The ta was an option.

All Super M's had disk brakes, the C-264 engine (instead of a 248 in the M's) and faster transmission gearing.

I have a 450, and I really like it. I have never compared the #s of 450s vs. the #s of Super MTA's, but in my mind the 450 is collectable because it is the last of the M series. I don't know that IH planned it this way, because I don't think they were on the drawing board then, but I can look at the 450, and sort of see the "beginnings" of the 706 and 806 creeping out, in terms of styling, etc.

Al

Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:01 am

Sorry that was my mistake. SM II, not SMTA II, duh!!

Oh yeah, Power Steering makes the 450 quite nice, too.

Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:13 am

I was reading SMTA and thinking SM - - old age sucks.......

Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:34 pm

Bigdog wrote:I was reading SMTA and thinking SM - - old age sucks.......


Yeah, but it beats the alternative :wink:

Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:05 pm

I had 2-super M-D's till I had to sell them 6 years ago,------live hyd,--disk brakes,--12-volt battery under the seat start on gas switch to diesel!!!-- never heard of any stage anything!!!---can't find it in my IH history book either! thanks; sonny

Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:14 am

SONNY wrote:I had 2-super M-D's till I had to sell them 6 years ago,------live hyd,--disk brakes,--12-volt battery under the seat start on gas switch to diesel!!!-- never heard of any stage anything!!!---can't find it in my IH history book either! thanks; sonny


I believe it's in Guy Fay's Letter Series Originality Guide. Again it was more internal IH nomenclature than how the tractors were advertised and sold, in other words IH dealers would have not told farmers "this is a stage II Super M, it's better than that Stage I because....."

Remember a Super M is a "Super" because it was updated with faster transmission gearing, more power (cubic inches,) and factory IH disk brakes. (To further muddy the water, some of the very last straight M's had disk brakes, and you could buy aftermarket disk brakes for earlier M's, but anyway....)

Stage I was the early Super M that still used th the old belly pump hydraulics.
Stage II was the Super M with live hydraulics, battery under the seat, etc.
Stage III was the Super MTA

Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:52 pm

And I have a '53 Louisville Super M with belly pump hydraulics and the battery under the seat.

Wed Jan 31, 2007 8:00 pm

Thanks for the info., guy's!!!-----There is probably lot's of company internal "stuff" that don't get to the public!!!----I'm sure not all the history writers know about all of it either!! Thanks, again: sonny