R.O.C.K Restoration Project

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tst
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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby tst » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:20 pm

you can try just a jumper wire to a good ground to the magneto and see if that kills the engine, the switch may not have a good ground through the dash with all the fresh paint

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Glen » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:27 pm

Hi,
Great that you got it to run.
Too bad the head is leaking.
All the head bolts need sealer applied to the threads only, about the bottom 3/8" of the bolts.
I would use the Permatex Aviation Form A Gasket. Stir up the can good first.

Like they said above, drain the coolant, and remove a head bolt and see if it has sealer on it.
If you find that you need to put sealer on all of them, if there is none on them, you will need to remove the hood, so you can torque the bolts again, and I would run fresh water down the bolt holes, to wash them out some. There is more chance of the sealer sticking if the anti freeze is removed from the threads. Leave the radiator drain plug out when doing that.
It would help the sealer stick if the bolt hole threads were dry, after washing the holes, you could use air down the holes to dry them, you can't really see when they are dry though.
Wash the bolts in water first too, and dry them.


Use pliers and carefully tighten the strainer bowl nut, and see if it quits dripping gas. It is probably not tight enough if it drips. Move the Touch Control arms to the rear position first, it is easier to get to it.
Do not leave gas on the new paint, catch the dripping gas somehow, and wipe up any that dripped on the paint right away, before it ruins the paint.

If your Touch Control lever is fully ahead in the pic of the Cub, it looks like something is not adjusted right, the rockshaft is not far enough up. It should turn a little more clockwise, viewed from the right side.

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Frozenstate » Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:34 am

If you have the fuel screen with the white plastic edge, that might be the problem. I tried one of those and couldn't get a seal. I finally put in the screen without the edging, screen only and it sealed. May be a trick to it though. I would like to know if anyone else had luck with the plastic edged screen.

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby staninlowerAL » Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:59 am

I have had better success with a nitrile gasket. It is petroleum resistant and more forgiving than cork. Beautiful restoration and top quality workmanship.

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby rockfarmer » Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:31 am

[quote="tst"]... air cleaner to head bolts need to be sealed also, .../quote]

Thank you for pointing that out. I would have never known.

I am pulling the hood off today and will remove the head bolts starting with the one that I pulled a few weeks ago to place the spark plug grommet clip. I don't remember re-applying sealant at that time.

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Jim in SC » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:56 pm

rockfarmer wrote:Spring Fever has hit central TX and Rocky is eat up with it.
Spring Fever.jpg

Notice the position of the hydraulic lever?

Static timed the magneto last night following the advice of several previous posts. Thank you to those of you who posted the how to's. Easiest thing I have done on this tractor, including applying decals. Fired him up today, after a prayer, and, he purrrrrrrrred like a fat kitten, even while the rear rockshaft slowly buried itself in the downward position. I am amazed at how smooth everything ran. Especially the engine. It would not crank or even cough until I let the choke in and immediately he fired up, without a hiccup. May have something to do with the high pressure 72 degree weather we had today. Great oil pressure, within 8 seconds of startup. Lot smoother than my other tractor with 12 volt electronic ignition and zenith carb. I might have just been sold on 6 volt magneto's.
I will post a video as soon as I can.

A few things that need immediate attention. Hopefully they are not too severe!

1. After the initial 5 minute run I pushed in the ignition and the tractor died. Second time I cranked it let it run for a few minutes, pushed in the ignition switch and the tractor kept running. Had to turn off fuel and let it run out to kill the engine. What should I check first?

2. I noticed a few small coolant droplets between the head and head gasket that appear to have small amounts of copper sealant mixed in.

Leak Head.jpg
Head leak.jpg
Behind the distributor is where coolant came out...enough to hit the ground, 1/2 teaspoon maybe. Re-torque the head bolts?

3. Fuel bowl leaking, not too bad. Could it be the new cork gasket needs time to swell or something? I changed bowls and same thing.

I am now, officially, hooked!


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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby rockfarmer » Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:01 am

All of the head bolts had aviation sealer applied on them. Still tacky.
Head bolts removed.jpg

So I carefully pried the head off to look for evidence. Not as pretty as it was a couple days ago. Also, please keep in mind that the 3rd time we cranked and let the tractor idle, the choke had inadvertently been pulled out. It ran for a minute or less, until I figured it out with black smoke coming out of the exhaust, and pushed in the choke. Then smoooooth. It was then that I noticed the weeping and turned off the tractor.
Head removal 2.jpg

There appears to be oil? in cylinders 2 and 3 while 1 and 4 were dry. Definitely a small amount of water present in cylinders 2 and 3.
block after initial crank.jpg

Head after startup.jpg

Did I let the gasket sealer dry too much before installing?

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby rockfarmer » Sat Mar 17, 2018 11:38 am

Could have been concentrated coolant, ethylene glycol, in the cylinders, which is a great solvent for carbon. No odor. Cleaned up things and I am prepared to install another head gasket and take two.

Note: It appears that where the weeps were, on each side of the "this side up" embossing, the leak on top of the gasket and the weep below the gasket. The area where the leak was, on the block, has the two - stamps side by side, between the coolant port and the side... not sure if this made a difference or just coincidence?
Block re-cleaned.jpg

Head re-cleaned.jpg


Question(s); Should I re-use the copper spray and install the head quickly? Did I use too much and would that cause the leakage? I am planning on using this gasket,
New Head gasket.jpg

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby tst » Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:29 pm

I give them 3 coats and install while it is tacky, I use a Teflon sealer on the bolts, no paint on the bottom of the bolt heads or the head surface where the bolts seat

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Glen » Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:49 pm

Hi,
If you still have it apart, I would use a long straight edge on the top of the block, after cleaning the block surface, and see if it is flat. You could also check the head with the straight edge.
One or both of them might not be flat.
While you are holding the edge tight against the parts, try sliding a .001" or .002" feeler gauge under the edge in many different places, and move the edge to different places also. The feeler gauge should not go in anywhere. If it does, try different thicker gauges and see how thick a gauge will go in the place. But the place could be narrower than a feeler gauge also.
You probably need another person to hold the edge down with both hands, while you use the feeler gauge.
You could also hold a light next to the edge while someone is holding it down tight, and see if you can see light under the edge, if you use something like a large building square.

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby k hutchins » Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:21 pm

I didn't go bac through the old posts when you originally installed the head, but remember ther is a specific order to tighten the bolts in. Also it was suggested to me that you do them in increments. Say 25 then 35, then 45. Start and run it for l think 45 minutes, then go back and retorque to specs. Some of mine were off by nearly 15 ftlbs when l retorqued.

Good luck
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby rockfarmer » Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:29 pm

It is still apart. I will check the flatness of both with a good straight edge. Don't have one now, but will start looking/asking.

I will re torque in 5 lb increments starting at 25 lbs and follow the proper sequence. No need to hurry. Originally, I torqued to 35, then 45, and probably should have re-torqued after running for a while. I saw the weeping and did not want to take any chances knowing I had another head gasket on hand.

Thank you all!

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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby AL Farmall Boy » Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:03 pm

Very Nice. I would do what Bill suggested and use a pony tank to run/work a couple times and then retourque bolts. Looking forward to the video.
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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Shane Nelson » Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:17 am

Tim, what's the status on Rocky? He still in surgery?
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Re: R.O.C.K Restoration Project

Postby Stanton » Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:53 am

Bummer on having the leaks, but I'm sure you'll get them fixed in short order. Nice work!

From the Farmall Cub Service Manaul-Engine, page 31:
Cub Head Bolt Torque Pattern.JPG
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