Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

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John *.?-!.* cub owner
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Mon Jun 23, 2014 2:01 pm

vwfish wrote:
fish, did you by chance change the carrier/hanger assembly for the throwout bearing when you were working on it?


No John I didn't, but the more I think about what's going on along with some of the comments and suggestions on this thread I think that is the next step along with the bearing yokes.
Would you agree?

Looking like another $100 in parts. The Mrs. is not going to be happy with that.
Normally that is not a necessary step. I did it on my loader cub because I had it apart to replace the front transmission seal, so decided to do it while I was at it. A loader gets a lot more clutch work than a normal cub, so I figured I would make it easier if clutch needed adjustment.

As a review, the fingers of the pressure plate should be adjusted so the face of the fingers that contact the throwout bearing are 1 1/4 inch from the side of the pressure plate next to the throwout bearing. Then the clevis should be adjusted to the point the pedal has about 1 inch of free play before the throwout bearing contacts the fingers. If all these are correct, you need to look elsewhere. Is it possible the disk is installed backwards? The friction plate should have the long part of the hub toward the throwout bearing. If it is reversed the hub may drag against the flywheel and keep the shaft from stopping.

Also, is it possible that in splitting the cub the transmission shaft may have become bent? Put the cub in 3rd gear, hold the brakes, and push the clutch down and try to start it. If it will crank over something is dragging, most likely the friciton disk, either back ward or faulty, or the pilot bearing, maybe slightly bent.
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby Posco » Tue Jun 24, 2014 4:49 pm

Boss Hog wrote:and some clutch kits are junk


Who makes a good one and where can I purchase it? And gears as well. Turns out the grinding I was hearing seems to be gear related. While he has the tractor apart it might be a good time to go ahead and address both.

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:04 pm

If you are referring to a grinding while trying to shift, that will be fixed when the clutch is. if you are talking about a grinding while driving, that is more than likely a bearing, but you need to diagnose it rather than throwing parts at it.
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby Posco » Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:39 am

John *.?-!.* cub owner wrote:If you are referring to a grinding while trying to shift, that will be fixed when the clutch is. if you are talking about a grinding while driving, that is more than likely a bearing, but you need to diagnose it rather than throwing parts at it.


Thanks, John. I started to take the final off myself but lost my nerve and took it to a local fellow. The first thing he did was pull the transmission cover and said everything in there is afloat. He has to split the tractor to address that issue so I thought it would make sense to go ahead and prepare myself for a new clutch as well.

I'm also quite certain there is a bearing gone in the left final. I'd like to get everything buttoned up so I can just enjoy my tractor trouble free for a while.

So back to my question, where do I get a quality clutch kit and gears?

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby vwfish » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:16 am

So a possible issue has been brought to my attention with my tractor.
I have the early linkage and a Rockford style clutch.
Are they compatible, or do I need to swap out the linkage?

I'll get this fixes yet....

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:56 am

vwfish wrote:So a possible issue has been brought to my attention with my tractor.
I have the early linkage and a Rockford style clutch.
Are they compatible, or do I need to swap out the linkage?

I'll get this fixes yet....
They are completely compatible, the only difference is the hanger bracket for the throwout and the linkage and clutch pedal. Whether it is an Auburn or Rockford clutch makes no difference.
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby vwfish » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:24 pm

Soooo.....what I thought was wrong is unfortunately not wrong. The hanger is fine, slight ware, but fine.
I took the yoke out and it looks....odd. There is some ware that appears to have elongated the holes, but never having seen one before I don't know if it's right or not.
Please see the attached and let me know what you all think.

Thanks!!!

I am unable to get Windows POS 8 to upload the pix.
I will try it from a computer that actually works tomorrow morning.

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby Bob McCarty » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:09 pm

Here's a picture from TM Tractor that shows the early yoke: Image

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby vwfish » Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:27 pm

Thanks Bob!
Well, the only difference I see is the holes where the bearing hangs are elongated on mine. I guess that might be the issue. If not, im stumped.
Question:
How much do the fingers have to be depressed for the clutch to disengage tbe tranmission?

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby pickerandsinger » Fri Jun 27, 2014 5:47 am

Posco wrote:
Boss Hog wrote:and some clutch kits are junk


Who makes a good one and where can I purchase it? And gears as well. Turns out the grinding I was hearing seems to be gear related. While he has the tractor apart it might be a good time to go ahead and address both.
IMHO, check with TM tractor (site sponsor)…Be especially concerned about the TO bearing should you decide to go elsewhere…Get a USA brand that comes greased …Their more money but worth it in the end….I have used rebuilt USA pressure plates (check the web)….The Chinese stuff, well you know….Not so good…2 cents worth of humble opinion….Gears I haven't had to replace…Think I'd check with Boss or Tim (TST) or JP Salvage (site sponsor )….Dave
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby Posco » Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:28 am

pickerandsinger wrote:
Posco wrote:
Boss Hog wrote:and some clutch kits are junk


Who makes a good one and where can I purchase it? And gears as well. Turns out the grinding I was hearing seems to be gear related. While he has the tractor apart it might be a good time to go ahead and address both.
IMHO, check with TM tractor (site sponsor)…Be especially concerned about the TO bearing should you decide to go elsewhere…Get a USA brand that comes greased …Their more money but worth it in the end….I have used rebuilt USA pressure plates (check the web)….The Chinese stuff, well you know….Not so good…2 cents worth of humble opinion….Gears I haven't had to replace…Think I'd check with Boss or Tim (TST) or JP Salvage (site sponsor )….Dave


Thanks for the input. Thus far, I've been a customer of TM but I don't think they carry a clutch kit, not as far as I remember seeing. Hamilton Bob's discontinued carrying them. I've seen the gears available.

I should get some news today I suspect as to the degree of troubles I'm facing. Folks here brought me a long ways as far as maintaining my tractor goes but I am not comfortable digging into the final, or the gears for that matter. I don't want to go to all the effort and miss something more experienced eyes would pick up. Thanks for your help.

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby vwfish » Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:24 am

Ok fellas',
I'm at my wits end!
After mulling this around for the past day I realized I might be dealing with after market BS!
I've read a lot about the after market spring plates not being so good.
I believe the unit I took out was after market and had possible issues resulting in the throw out bearing being eaten.
I know I replaced it with an after market unit and I have similar issues.
I'm to the point where I'm thinking about tearing all the after market stuff out and putting in used/rebuilt/new original parts even though they are big bucks (much to the dislike of my boss).

Can I see a show of hands who would agree this is the next logical step?

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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby pickerandsinger » Fri Jun 27, 2014 2:44 pm

I have a tractor split right now and am also rebuilding the engine…The throwout bearing is worn down to nothing on the bottom….The Pressure plate fingers were not set correctly one was out of whack..…They should be 1 1/4….7/8th is not going to work at least the way I measure it….I had a lengthy discussion with a supplier about this in the past and he told me he would not guarantee the clutch if it was set at 1 1/4….USA rebuilt…It had to be 7/8 ….I said ok to him and set it at 1 1/4 anyway…If it needed to be replaced I would set it back to 7/8 th.s..I set the clutch travel at 1 inch….The clutch works fine…however I give it 5 seconds before I shift to any gear…The engagement point seems a little high on the pedal compared to my 57 lo boy but it works fine…I am going to do the same with the one that is being rebuilt now…I think when you get close to the 1 1/4 it is important they all be set as close as possible…Be it a little off, as long as all 3 are the same, I find that is an important factor….The tractors I speak of are a 53 and a 54 with the outside adjustment on the pedal….The 5 second rule I find is important also…Just drawing on my personal experience….Dave…And grease the pilot bushing as Boss suggested….I use Moly on the pilot….A dab on the end of the trans shaft….
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby Boss Hog » Fri Jun 27, 2014 5:42 pm

Fish, did you grease the pilot bushing?
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Re: Clutch Adjustment Problem.....HELP!!!

Postby vwfish » Fri Jun 27, 2014 7:59 pm

Yes, it was greased.
How far do the fingers have to move to completely engage the clutch?
It just seems like things aren't moving far enough to disengage the drive shaft.
When I try and shift into a gear it's not a little "rip" and then it slides into gear, it is obvious nasty grinding and does not go into gear.
The way the old throw out bearing wore (see pix earlier in this post) has to be a clue as to what the issue is.
I'm thinking pull out the after market stuff, beg for forgiveness when the CC bill shows up and pay for original parts.

Thoughts?


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