Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:03 am

Hi fellas! (And ladies?) I haven't been on in a few weeks. Hope all is well!

My '54 Betty was at Cecil's Cubfest back in October (Cecil broke my Cubfest virginity! :lol: ) and we swapped out my cracked hydraulic reservoir for a replacement box and internal components. I noticed a few changes with the new unit and wanted to get some feedback.

We swapped out the new reservoir, filled it with hydraulic fluid, and it worked right at the start. In the coming days I started to hear an occasional whining. I checked the hydraulic fluid yesterday prior to plowing and noticed it was low. I wouldn't find that all too surprising. Since we were losing sunlight fast, we filled it at the Cubfest without really cycling the :censored: out of the touch control to properly bleed it. When I filled it yesterday, the extra poured out as a milky white. It appeared to be bubbly. A note here, I see no indication of any hydraulic fluid leaking into the crankcase. Oil appears clean and the dip stick doesn't show that I have an abnormally high amount of fluid.

Prior to posting this morning I read the touch control section of the manual and searched other threads here. Seems any air leak into the hydraulics will make this whining happen. This morning I started Betty and let her warm up a bit. No whining. I then took the reservoir filler lug off and the whine started immediately. I cycled the touch control about twenty times to bleed the system and make sure the fluid level was where it should be. Seemed good. Put the plug back on. I let it run for about twenty minutes and the whine started again. Note also that the whine stops when I move the touch control and then starts when it has completed its movement.

My questions:

1) Where would the most likely leak be? We only removed the rear hydraulic lines to the case and used a new gasket.
2) Also seems as though the blade will raise three times as fast as it lowers. What would cause that?

Thank you in advance for your assistance!
Calvin

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:15 am

Does it whine when the control lever is in the center of travel, or only when at the ends of the travel?

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:20 am

Only at the ends of travel.

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:23 am

Hey Calvin....It sounds like contaminated fluid , white signifying water, and I suppose bubbles could mean air but also water does that......What did we fill that with...Maybe you could try changing the fluid....I've been using TSC hydraulic fluid ( the one that says ,hytran acceptable, on the back label...Its 18.99 for two gallons last I bought it) or new hytran...If its not that it sound like it might be a pump issue....Cecil is in the shadows ( I just got a pm from him)...You might try pm,ing him....He has alot more insight into things hydraulic than I....I just am the guy who helped you change the unit... :lol: Have a good day bud....Dave

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:31 am

Dave! My right hand man! Hey buddy! OK so after posting my inquiry I went outside to check on how tight the bolts were that fasten the hydraulic lines to the reservoir case. It seems I can actually tighten them without putting some major weight into them so I think this might be the culprit. The only question is how tight can I make these bolts without doing damage or snapping them? Since they seem to be, at the very least, not as tight as they should be, let's start there and pray to the great Cub God Farmallius! :worthy:

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:32 am

pickerandsinger wrote:Maybe you could try changing the fluid....I've been using TSC hydraulic fluid...


That's what we filled it with. Seems to be decent stuff!

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:58 am

If you haven't found your leak yet and the problem still exists check you engine crankcase oil level. If the hydraulic pump is leaking the oil level in the engine will increase .

Berlin

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:00 am

Connecticut Calvin wrote:Only at the ends of travel.

The stops that limit the travel of the control lever may need adjusting. (I don't have time to explain the procedure right now. It is in the Touch-Control Servicemans Guide (manuals at the top of this page), or can probably be found by a search here.)

If that isn't it, you may have a bit of contamination on the orifice, accessable through the pipe plug in the Touch-Control head.

Or it may be the nature of the beast. Some are noisier than others.

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:11 am

A couple of comments. You cannot tell you are losing hydraulic fluid into crankcase by the looks of engine oil. Any water causing it to be milky or any air bubbles will be gone as soon as the engine reaches operating temperature. You cannot check hydraulic fluid level just by looking, there is a ledge with a lip on it that reaches about an inch into the touch control and hold oil on it. The actual reservoir is beyond that so you have to reach inside the unit a ways to verify the level. My preferred method is a bent wire to use as a dipstick.

One note, and I may be opening a can of worms here, I have been trying some of the HyTran compatible fluids, and they seem to work acceptably, but I have noticed one difference. In cold weather (mid teens to lower 20s) the hydraulics are noticeably more sluggish with the compatible fluids than Hytran, especially going down where it is going through the retarder valve.

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:37 pm

Calvin I'm pretty sure that the control lever is out of adjustment at the end of the travel. Betsy has done that forever and I know not to push the lever to far. I probably should fix it some day. LOL.

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 2:20 pm

Wow fellas as usual a stellar response! :{_}: And we're all over the map for solutions :? but it turns out that in fact the hydraulic lines connected to the reservoir just weren't tight enough. I believe DAVE tightened them! BAD DAVE! Just kidding, it was me, I admit. :oops: I kept the tractor running and had my neighbor move the touch control back and forth while I slowly tightened each bolt with a short ratchet. I tightened each bolt a bit, then to the next, clockwise, to maintain even pressure on the gasket. Each turn made a noticable difference and the last tightening rotation did the trick. Not a single peep from the hydraulics any more. :{_}: :{_}: :{_}: Ol' Betty is keeping me entertained for sure. Lots of good hydraulic data here. I'm going to go back and make sure levels are all good. THANK YOU gentlemen!

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 3:50 pm

Connecticut Calvin wrote: I believe DAVE tightened them! BAD DAVE! Just kidding, it was me, I admit.
Yep thats for sure, I am definetly not known for under tightening...Stripping, breaking but never untightening.... :lol: :lol:Thats why in the shop I now have a 3/8 and 1/2 torque wrench... Glad you found it, I hear you got some snow coming...( I'm in Florida awaiting a rotator cuff op on Friday...) Too much bolt bending and breaking :lol: :lol:

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:23 pm

pickerandsinger wrote:
Connecticut Calvin wrote: I believe DAVE tightened them! BAD DAVE! Just kidding, it was me, I admit.
Yep thats for sure, I am definetly not known for under tightening...Stripping, breaking but never untightening.... :lol: :lol:Thats why in the shop I now have a 3/8 and 1/2 torque wrench... Glad you found it, I hear you got some snow coming...( I'm in Florida awaiting a rotator cuff op on Friday...) Too much bolt bending and breaking :lol: :lol:


Ha! That's hilarious! :lol: Florida huh? You come all the way up to NY to see our butts and you're in Florida?!

A potential "potent" storm on the way. Good thing I had these little dusters the last few days. I needed practice on how to plow my difficult driveway! But Betty just pushes anything in her way. I LOVE this tractor! :-:-):

Re: Hydraulic Whine - Slow Operation

Thu Dec 12, 2013 6:42 am

I got a place in Central New York April 1st till ???? Then to Florida for the winter months. :D ...
Connecticut Calvin wrote: Florida huh? You come all the way up to NY to see our butts and you're in Florida?!