Engine seized? 1950 Cub

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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby clodhopper » Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:20 pm

My money is on the fan hub. If it has oil and pressure, chances are the engine has not bit the dust. I have seen alot of these little machines that were terribly neglected for YEARS, and were coaxed back to life with a minimum of effort. They are VERY reliable.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby marshall » Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:33 pm

Thanks for the encouragement. So I've taken the cover off and followed the manual instructions for lubricating the fan hub. Seems a bit strange. I turned the hub so the screw was horizontal and facing me, removed screw, pumped in quite a bit of SAE30 oil (maybe 8 oz). Nothing was spilling out. But the instructions say to turn the hub so the hole is downward and then to drain this off so I did that and oil comes leaking out. I put the screw back in. So can I assume the fan hub has been correctly lubricated?

Next I removed oil filter and cranked engine by pulling starter rod with ignition switch in(off). I don't have a hand crank. I witnessed oil flowing into the bottom of the filter canister so I guess we've confirmed good oil circulation.

Mention was made above about lubricating the generator. I read the owners manual and when it comes to the how lube the generator it says "Generator Lubrication (2 cups): Follow the lubricating instructions for the generator, as outlined in the Lubrication Guide ...."

I looked at the lubrication guide for GSS-1013 Engine (like in above post) but no mention of the generator. I'm guessing there must be a pretty obvious port if I'm going to put 2 cups of oil into the generator. Can anyone tell me how to check/lube the generator. I put a photograph of the generator on my webserver so you can make ref to it.

http://sugaree.cs.umass.edu/cub/generator.jpg

I should say that pulling the starter rod does indeed crank the engine. All these belts and shafts are turning. So I'll follow the advice above and not try to start it. But this tractor is currently stuck out in my back field. I don't have a trailer or a road-legal truck to take this thing anywhere. I've got a junker truck that I can use to pull the tractor back to my house but then I'm going to have to work on this problem here which will have to involve trying to start it when you guys tell me you think I've done enough things to give it a go...

UHaul rental truck+trailer was what I had to do to get it. It gets expensive. So I'm not sure I'll be able to go to the cub fest this year even though it sounds like I'd get a lot of help in getting this rig in better shape. I'm hoping we can do a good bit with this forum thread. I can take pictures, movies, etc and post.

So I'm going to search around a bit more for info on generator lube, but let me know what you think I ought to do with that.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Bill Hudson » Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:50 pm

The "cups" being referred to are little tubes covered with spring loaded caps at each end of the generator. Your pic clearly shows the one near the belt pulley. The other one is not visible in your pic. A few (very few) squirts from an oil can will be sufficient.

Hope this helps.

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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby tmays » Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:56 pm

Usually there is a lube point on each end of the generator. They have a small spring loaded cap on each one. Small about 1/4 inch. They are usually referred to as cups. Just takes a few drops of oil on each one

Edit: Mr Bill 'Quick Draw' Hudson beat me to it :-)
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby kajun » Tue Sep 24, 2013 4:47 pm

I will join with many of the others in encouraging you to go to the nearby Cubfest. I missed the last Louisiana-one several years ago because I was limited for time . I have devoted countless hours and countless dollars continually repairing something [paying for those repairs and doing the logistics to get my Cub to repairers ] that the kind folk here would have done for free . What's more the repairs would have been done in one week-end and correctly.

There are few communities like this one . So don't pass up the help you are being offered. Rent the U-Haul again . I promise you it will be cheaper in the long run.

Best to you and thanks to all who have bailed me out over the years.

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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Rudi » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:28 pm

marshall wrote:UHaul rental truck+trailer was what I had to do to get it.


U-haul trailer is the current plan to fetch my Ohio Lo-Boy and make it a NB Lo-Boy :D It is a long way to Tipperary .. or in this case Valatie NY from Dieppe NB, but it is really worth the effort to get there. I enjoy myself immensely when Em and I go .. this is our 3rd time heading to Cecil's :{_}:

marshall wrote:I looked at the lubrication guide for GSS-1013 Engine (like in above post) but no mention of the generator.


It looks like both of the cups are there. The thingys with the little flapper on them. A couple drops of oil is sufficient.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby marshall » Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:38 pm

OK. I think all your inputs have yielded success. I found the two oiling inputs on the generator and gave them a squirt. I started the tractor up and ran it. Oil pressure is
far over to the right. I went and cut some goldenrod down for an hour and it worked beautifully. Hey, this was way easier than I thought. It came down to some squirts of oil
in the right spots.

So this cub fest is where/when? You guys are rockin. I have to use forums like this for software (I develop software) and its just great that I can have an obscure bug or want to know how to do some thing and there's always someone who's hit the issue before and I can find a thread describing what to do. But this one was live. It was my post and within 24 hours I had a bunch of answers and my machine is working again. I was really feeling ripped off on Sunday and now I'm in a much better mood so thank you all immensely!

I will take the advice that the machine probably does need all its fluids changed. I guess I also need to know all these little oiling areas because obviously they are critical.

I'm finding its not that easy to start. I notice that it turns over and sounds like it's catching and then there's sort of a Shhhhheeeeeen sound and the shaft stops turning even though I still have the starter rod pulled . I have to do it 4 or 5 times before it catches and smoke starts to come out of the stack. Any ideas on why this happens?
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Rudi » Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:24 pm

Marshall:

Glad you got it running and it runs fine. That is a good thing. Me thinks you need to come to CubFest Northeast .. it is in Valatie NY Columbus Day weekend, October 11th - 13th, 2013. This is the directions from Chesterfield Ma to Valatie NY. About an hour and a half from you west on Rt 9.

marshall wrote:I notice that it turns over and sounds like it's catching and then there's sort of a Shhhhheeeeeen sound and the shaft stops turning even though I still have the starter rod pulled . I have to do it 4 or 5 times before it catches and smoke starts to come out of the stack. Any ideas on why this happens?


Well, that can be kinda normal until you get your Cub tuned up properly. That noise you are hearing is the bendix not catching the ring gear so the engine isn't turning over. Don't let it do that .. you can damage the starter that way. You may not have the carb choked sufficiently or the fuel may not be turned all the way on???? There might be a little carbon built up. Not sure what you are doing. This is all stuff that can be discussed in depth at Cecil's next month. Do try to come with or without your Cub.

Also with these tractors and their age, like all of us older things, we squeak a lot, sometimes we smoke a bit when we first start up in the morning.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Mike in Louisiana » Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:22 am

Marshall, You do not have to bring your cub to a cub fest. You will still learn a lot without your cub being there. And don't forget this is family oriented so bring the wife and kids.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Smokeycub » Wed Sep 25, 2013 9:02 am

I have just one question, what does the oil pressure gauge read after warmed up at idle? It should come down somewhat. ...and I too will suggest you go to that Cubfest, tractor or not. Great people on here and much can be gleaned from these fine folks.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby marshall » Wed Sep 25, 2013 8:55 pm

The oil pressure gauge seems to stay pretty high. Initially in the middle for a few secs and then stays over to the right as it idles. I'll give it a longer look on Saturday and see if it comes down a bit.
Should I be concerned about the high oil prssure?
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Matt Kirsch » Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:04 am

High oil pressure *could* indicate that a passage is blocked, preventing oil from getting somewhere.

If you ran it over an hour, and it didn't seize on you, you're reasonably safe.

The stock gauge on a tractor that age only measures 35PSI at maximum IIRC. It might be a good idea to pick up an inexpensive oil pressure test gauge from Harbor Freight or an auto parts store, and plug it in where the stock gauge is now, to see exactly how many PSI oil pressure you have. It could be 34, or it could be 70...
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Rudi » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:53 pm

Marshall:

If you want to check accurately your oil pressure then the best way is to make your own. Pretty simple. Get one of the gauges that reads up to say 100 psi, make sure the fittings match the one on your existing gauge and then replace the current IH gauge with that one. Run the tractor. Should tell you exactly what your pressure is.

Oh yeah, like Mike said, you don't really have to bring your Cub ... you will learn a lot either way. And yes, CubFests are family affairs. My bride and I are both attending as are many other couples and families.
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Re: Engine seized? 1950 Cub

Postby Smokeycub » Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:41 am

marshall wrote:he oil pressure gauge seems to stay pretty high. Initially in the middle for a few secs and then stays over to the right as it idles. I'll give it a longer look on Saturday and see if it comes down a bit.
Should I be concerned about the high oil prssure?

If the gauge reads "in the middle" with the engine not running then your gauge isn't reading right. Sounds like it's time for a new one.
Matt Kirsch wrote:High oil pressure *could* indicate that a passage is blocked, preventing oil from getting somewhere.

If you ran it over an hour, and it didn't seize on you, you're reasonably safe.
As the others have said something could be blocked but unless it's making any strange knocking noises I agree with Matt. IMHO I would check the oil pressure with a different gauge if for nothing more than knowing for sure. I know I would feel better knowing if it's the gauge or something more.
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