58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

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58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Tractorboy3 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:42 pm

Hi guys...If you have been following my recent posts..I am in the process of putting my 58 Cub transmission back together...After dis-assembly, and cleaning, cleaning, and more cleaning of parts, I am at the point of test fitting the trans back together.
I have all new bearings, seals, gaskets...Awaiting new 2nd/3rd gear from Chris D..What a nice group of people here willing to help..Thanks again Chris D....Any way to my question...I am test fitting everything back together..There are shims in the front of the countershaft nut to set the " backlash " between the bevel pinion gear and the differential gear. I have 5 shims, .004 times 3, .008, and .015 to equal .035...I have locked the trans into two gears at the same time to torque the countershaft nut...Seems like there is way too much play or backlash between the pinion gear and differential gear...took it apart many times and ended up with .012 from .035 to what " Feels rite "...Does this sound rite??..How do you guys set this clearance ????
Thanks again to everyone here...couldn't do this stuff without help from you all here....Tom

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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Rudi » Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:46 pm

Tom:

Looks like you have it well in hand. Nice looking tranny, very clean. Easier to work on that way. Very organized. I like that.
I really like that floor mat too. Definitely going to have to get me a couple. Those are slick. Keep updating us please. The pics are very helpful.
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby RaymondDurban » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:11 am

Tom, did you install the differential first and check/adjust the bearing preload?
After this is done, the differential is removed, then the countershaft is installed, and the differential installed again and then the backlash is checked, aiming for .003-.005" of movement. Do you have a dial indicator?

Spend a bit of time reading chapter six of the GSS-1411 Service Manual. It explains just about everything you need to know with regards to setting preloads, backlash and clearances.
http://www.cleancomputes.com/Cub/Blue%2 ... ential.htm
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Tractorboy3 » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:24 am

RaymondDurban wrote:Tom, did you install the differential first and check/adjust the bearing preload?
After this is done, the differential is removed, then the countershaft is installed, and the differential installed again and then the backlash is checked, aiming for .003-.005" of movement. Do you have a dial indicator?

Spend a bit of time reading chapter six of the GSS-1411 Service Manual. It explains just about everything you need to know with regards to setting preloads, backlash and clearances.
http://www.cleancomputes.com/Cub/Blue%2 ... ential.htm


Ray...how are you pulling the differential bearing retainers out...I am having a real hard time getting them back out to adjust the pre-load on the bearings??...there is just no way to grab them to pull back out???
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby RaymondDurban » Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:36 am

Roll the transmission on its left side. With both the left and right retainer bolts removed, take a brass punch and tap it against the retainer to rotate it around, say a quarter of a turn. Then with two pry bars, pry/pull it out gently, being very carefully not to damage the shims. After the right one is out, take a block of wood, and tap the differential down to push the left side out. After both are out, remove the o-rings from the retainers and reinstall to adjust the preload. Don't install the new o-rings until everything is correct with preloads and backlash, and you are ready to reinstall on the tractor. Otherwise, the retainer will be real tight and you'll end up tearing up the o-rings.

Edit: spelling and clarification
Last edited by RaymondDurban on Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby randallc » Sat Jul 27, 2013 5:52 am

You gott'er clean as a hen's tooth. A very nice work place. Thanks for folks like Raymond ... cause I'd be lost. And also thanks for the pictures. Now if I could just remember all of that. But.....what was I saying!
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby LeeC » Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:21 am

Here is my experience with backlash. First, adjust the differential bearing preload as Raymond said. Second, if you are using the same case, use the same shims in the front that were there before. The shims are there to compensate for variations in cases. The ring and pinion have worn in together at a particular place and it is best to maintain that relationship. Third, you cannot check backlash correctly unless the countershaft front cap assembly (including gasket) is completely torqued down (I wasted a lot of time here). The manual calls for 35 ft-lbs. That is an awful lot of torque for a 5/16-18 bolt. I tried that and the bolts started to yield before I got there. I ended up at 20 ft-lbs as is called for for the upper shaft retainer. Just my experience.

On my transmission, I ended up removing a thin shim on each side of the differential to get the bearing preload right. After I reassembled the countershaft and differential (all bolts torqued), I was not sure about the backlash (I do not have a gauge). I decided to try moving a thin shim from one differential bearing retainer to the other to reduce the backlash and got binding at the pinion/ring gears. I knew then I had the backlash at the minimum by moving the bearing retainer shim back to the other side.
Last edited by LeeC on Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby RaymondDurban » Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:37 am

Randall, when you get to Colorado, we'll have one for you to tear apart and put back together! :D
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby randallc » Sat Jul 27, 2013 9:40 am

Good deal Raymond, I'll be looking forward to it. I got one I need to put into a new housing one of these days.
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics update 1

Postby Tractorboy3 » Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:57 am

RaymondDurban wrote:Tom, did you install the differential first and check/adjust the bearing preload?
After this is done, the differential is removed, then the countershaft is installed, and the differential installed again and then the backlash is checked, aiming for .003-.005" of movement. Do you have a dial indicator?

Spend a bit of time reading chapter six of the GSS-1411 Service Manual. It explains just about everything you need to know with regards to setting preloads, backlash and clearances.
http://www.cleancomputes.com/Cub/Blue%2 ... ential.htm


Ok...Took everything back apart to set pre-load..ended up taking out .004 shim to get 1-8 lbs of pull.

LeeC wrote:Here is my experience with backlash. First, adjust the differential bearing preload as Raymond said. Second, if you are using the same case, use the same shims in the front that were there before. The shims are there to compensate for variations in cases. The ring and pinion have worn in together at a particular place and it is best to maintain that relationship. Third, you cannot check backlash correctly unless the countershaft front cap assembly (including gasket) is completely torqued down (I wasted a lot of time here). The manual calls for 35 ft-lbs. That is an awful lot of torque for a 5/16-18 bolt. I tried that and the bolts started to yield before I got there. I ended up at 20 ft-lbs as is called for for the upper shaft retainer. Just my experience.

On my transmission, I ended up removing a thin shim on each side of the differential to get the bearing preload right. After I reassembled the countershaft and differential (all bolts torqued), I was not sure about the backlash (I do not have a gauge). I decided to try moving a thin shim from one differential bearing retainer to the other to reduce the backlash and got binding at the pinion/ring gears. I knew then I had the preload at the minimum by moving the bearing retainer shim back to the other side.


Then I put back all the shims on the countershaft..I ended up moving .007 to the right side bearing retainer to get the proper .003-.005 backlash...
NOW it feels rite....Thanks guys....Awaiting prussian blue ordered at NAPA as final check.... :D
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Boss Hog » Sun Jul 28, 2013 9:20 am

you can use thick cup grease in a pinch, it aint rocket science :D
you are looking good with the trans. How was the bushing in the idler gear? They are prone to causing a noise if worn much
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby RaymondDurban » Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:48 am

White acrylic paint and gear lube mixed 50/50 works good too. The Prussian blue works, but is difficult to see the pattern.
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Tractorboy3 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:59 pm

Hi Guys....Update..Got her back on her feet..all four wheels for a test of the newly rebuilt transmission..Smooth, Quiet, Tight...Nice..
So a quick and general update of the restoration...
Honed cylinders, rings, valves, guides, newly cut seats, complete clutch asembly, transmission bearings, 1st/rev gear, final drive seals, brake drums, bands, reproduction IH carburetor, radiator hoses with Wittek clamps, rebuilt starter, seat, tested generator, fan shroud, belts, throttle sector, Pedal springs, all associated gaskets and seals...Plus much more along the way I have forgotten....


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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Denny Clayton » Fri Sep 20, 2013 10:14 am

Looks like a beauty!
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Re: 58 Cub Transmission rebuild..Pics

Postby Smokeycub » Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:04 am

Wow! Really looking good!
Tractorboy3 wrote:a test of the newly rebuilt transmission..Smooth, Quiet, Tight...Nice..
So a quick and general update of the restoration...
Honed cylinders, rings, valves, guides, newly cut seats, complete clutch asembly, transmission bearings, 1st/rev gear, final drive seals, brake drums, bands, reproduction IH carburetor, radiator hoses with Wittek clamps, rebuilt starter, seat, tested generator, fan shroud, belts, throttle sector, Pedal springs, all associated gaskets and seals...Plus much more along the way I have forgotten....

...and a quite trans/dif/finals - nice! Well done. It'll be like a brand new '58.
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