my no start situation

Farmall Cub Forum -- Questions and answers to all of your Cub related issues.

Moderator: Team Cub

Forum rules
Notice: For sale and wanted posts are not allowed in this forum. Please use our free classifieds or one of our site sponsors for your tractor and parts needs.

my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:26 pm

i still have a no start problem after replacing points, condenser,coil, wires, cap, and rebuilding the carb. after doing so i was still just getting spark but no fire or starting. last night i adjusted the valves there was no clearance. now i have fire and back fire and the ocasional flame out the exhaust. im pretty sure everything is in time. i am just using the hand crank which wears me out. i was thinking of trying to roll or push/pull to try to start it since the electric starter is dead. maybe it needs a little more oomph than what i can give it at the crank. i appreciate any suggestions. thanks
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby Hengy » Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:29 pm

Timing is 180* out. Check your plug wires to make sure that they go 1-3-4-2 starting at the 1:00 position on the distributor/mag cap. Usually there is a #1 on the cap.

Is this a mag or a distributor?

Mike
Mike (Happy as a Lark in Allison Park, PA)
Image Image

Check out my Restoration Thread (1955 Cub, Lewis)
User avatar
Hengy
501 Club
501 Club
 
Posts: 6962
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:12 pm
Location: PA, Allison Park (Am Hengelsberg)
Zip Code: 15101
eBay ID: lacrosseorgans
Skype Name: Mike.Hengelsberg
Tractors Owned: 1949 Cub "Merlin"
1955 Cub "Lewis"
Cub Trailer
A-60 Blade
Cub-22 Mower
193 Plow
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby ricky racer » Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:39 pm

Hengy is right on target. However it sounds like one of my Cubs when I bought it. It was 90 degrees out of time. Bring #1 cylinder up to TDC on the compression stroke. Line up the timing mark with the pointer. Pull off the distributor cap an look at the position of the rotor. It should be pointing right at the location of the #1 spark plug wire lug on the cap. If it's not there, and the wiring is correct, you need to pull the distributor and rotate it to where it needs to be. Don't adjust the wiring to match a mistimed distributor.
1929 Farmall Regular
1935 John Deere B
1937 John Deere A
1941 John Deere H
1952 John Deere B
1953 Farmall Cub
User avatar
ricky racer
501 Club
501 Club
 
Posts: 2749
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:40 pm
Location: Niles / Buchanan, Michigan
Zip Code: 49120
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby Jim Kr » Mon Jul 08, 2013 8:03 pm

You mentioned replacing everything, but I didn't see plugs. I had the same issue 2 falls ago. My wife suggested changing the plugs, but I just cleaned them instead. I changed all the stuff you mentioned. Still no joy.

I changed the plugs. Guess what... :wink:
Jim Kr is a grease-stained wretch
Jim Kr
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:25 pm
Location: Dunnville, Kentucky
Zip Code: 42528

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:28 am

sorry i forgot to mention i replaced the plugs. i guess tomorrow i will check the timing again. i was placing my thumb on the #1 plug hole and cranking it over untill i felt compression then when i felt no more compression the pulley notch lined up with the engine cover arrow or pointer, it apeared to be pointed to the #1 plug on the capbut maybe it was actually pointing to the # 3 plug or whatever is 180 degrees or directly below the #1 plug if that makes sence. thanks again
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:28 am

sorry i forgot to mention i replaced the plugs. i guess tomorrow i will check the timing again. i was placing my thumb on the #1 plug hole and cranking it over untill i felt compression then when i felt no more compression the pulley notch lined up with the engine cover arrow or pointer, it apeared to be pointed to the #1 plug on the capbut maybe it was actually pointing to the # 3 plug or whatever is 180 degrees or directly below the #1 plug if that makes sence. thanks again
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:31 am

oh sorry i forgot to mention its a magneto with an external coil
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby Rick Spivey » Tue Jul 09, 2013 5:06 am

Just a check, mag with external coil still needs to have points gapped to 0.013".
Rick Spivey
'52 Cub ("Great Personality") 148xxx
'48 Cub with FH ("Gunny Cub") 38xxx
'57 Lambretta (a slow work in progress)
'74 Triumph TR6 (Mama's toy)
User avatar
Rick Spivey
Cub Pro
Cub Pro
 
Posts: 1709
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:07 pm
Location: SC, Simpsonville 29681
Zip Code: 29681
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Wed Jul 10, 2013 7:31 pm

i had the points gapped to .013. i just dont understand this thing. i checked my timing the rotor didnt seem to point directly to the #1 on the cap but sort of in between #1 and #2. i took off the rotor to see if its teeth were chipped since there was some wobble. they looked fine i put it back on in the same spot and now i dont even get the "pop" of the cylinder firing so i guess i messed the rotor timing up must be a tooth or so off. man i wish an expert lived close to me. i know there are some notches to line up the rotor assembly to time it. how do i go about doing that. and should there be any movement with the rotor connected to the mag? thanks for the patience and help
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby Rick Spivey » Wed Jul 10, 2013 8:23 pm

There should be very little "wiggle" between the rotor and pinion gear.There are scribe lines cast into the plastic parts, usually a line down the rotor, and a "triangle" cast onto the pinion. Be sure those are lined up. Then retime the mag to the engine, if needed. That should get you close enough to run.
Rick Spivey
'52 Cub ("Great Personality") 148xxx
'48 Cub with FH ("Gunny Cub") 38xxx
'57 Lambretta (a slow work in progress)
'74 Triumph TR6 (Mama's toy)
User avatar
Rick Spivey
Cub Pro
Cub Pro
 
Posts: 1709
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:07 pm
Location: SC, Simpsonville 29681
Zip Code: 29681
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Thu Jul 11, 2013 1:44 am

i've wathched the video on youtube to static time the mag from Hengy (thanks by the way) it seems very straightforward. since i screwed up the rotor timing. should i line the rotor and pinion marks up and spin the mag around counter clockwise until the mag snaps at the 1:00 position so the rotor would be pointing to the #1 plug on the cap? i guess what i am trying to say is are the rotor and pinion markss lined up while pointing to the #1 plug at tdc of the #1 cylinder? sorry for the confusion
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby Rick Spivey » Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:09 am

It's actually easier than that. The rotor and pinion MUST be lined up, not negotiable. Once that is done, the lugs that drive the mag will only let it go in one of two ways. So what is important when installing the mag back into the engine is that:

- the drive lugs are at approximately the 2:00 and 8:00 position when looking at the governor drive
- the engine is at TDC of cylinder 1
- the rotor is pointing toward number 1 on the distributor cap

If all of that is correct, then time it as shown in the video. If any of that is not lined up like I described, there will be issues, and a probable "no-run" condition.

To answer you specifically, yes, line up the rotor/pinion, then spin the mag so that the rotor points to number 1 when installing it back into the engine, assuming you have engine positioned as above.
Rick Spivey
'52 Cub ("Great Personality") 148xxx
'48 Cub with FH ("Gunny Cub") 38xxx
'57 Lambretta (a slow work in progress)
'74 Triumph TR6 (Mama's toy)
User avatar
Rick Spivey
Cub Pro
Cub Pro
 
Posts: 1709
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:07 pm
Location: SC, Simpsonville 29681
Zip Code: 29681
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Thu Jul 11, 2013 3:49 pm

i noticed on the back of the magneto where in has the slots to connect with the govenor there is an arrow pointing up and an R off to the side of it does that mean the arrow should be poining up like the rotor should if properly timed at tdc? thanks
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Re: my no start situation

Postby Rick Spivey » Thu Jul 11, 2013 4:54 pm

Honestly don't know, never noticed the arrow. Pointing you back, just line everything up as I mentioned in the previous post, and it should start, assuming the mag internals are good.
Rick Spivey
'52 Cub ("Great Personality") 148xxx
'48 Cub with FH ("Gunny Cub") 38xxx
'57 Lambretta (a slow work in progress)
'74 Triumph TR6 (Mama's toy)
User avatar
Rick Spivey
Cub Pro
Cub Pro
 
Posts: 1709
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:07 pm
Location: SC, Simpsonville 29681
Zip Code: 29681
Circle of Safety Award
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: my no start situation

Postby 1990caprice » Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:11 am

well i got everything lined up and timed . it didnt seem like the timing was off. i brought the #1 cylinder to tdc, the rotor was pointing to it, pulled the mag the governer notches were at 2 at 8:30 o clock or was very close ,inserted the mag back in with rotor pointing to 1oclock, pushed it to the block, spun the engine oner once the mag snaped once then i went to top dead center pulled the mag back and got the snap and tighted up spun it around and the mag would snap right when it hit tdc. i put the plug and wire back on and tried to start but nothing. it still has spark as i checked. the cylinder is just not firing. i am totally baffled it was firing and puffing the other day only after ajusting the valves. i guess i'm going to have to give it a compression check (like i should have done in the first place) i had read in my truck's service manual one time you couldnt get a good spark if it has low compression. the tractor has a bright blue spark that will jump nearly a half an inch on all cylinders. anyways i will post my compression readings soon as i perform the test. thanks for everyone's assistance
1990caprice
Cub Star
Cub Star
 
Posts: 54
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 am
Zip Code: 40508

Next

Return to Farmall Cub

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: havoc1482, RaymondDurban and 6 guests