Motor questions

[Stan_VA]

I'm looking for recommendations on engine parts suppliers and piston types. I'm working on a '48 model and this is my first C60 though I have alot of experience with C113/123's.

I have read several good recommendations for TM that's listed here on the home page, but I don't see that they offer piston sets, just rings and bearings? I see that YTMag has flat tops (Tisco), agkits.com lists a 'retro-fit dome design' piston which I assume is closer to the 154/184 piston. I've had no problems with the Tisco kits in the past (on Super C/H/M motors), no experience with agkits though.

Has anyone on here actually tried the agkits pistons? Has anyone taken compression readings across a flat vs dome top motor willing to post their findings?

My book shows 6.5:1 compression ratio and I don't have anything that lists the later cubs for comparison. AFAIK the cylinder head didn't change accross the later models? (so I wouldn't expect a difference from that, and don't think interference would be a problem.) Unfortunatly this motor was seized so I don't have any 'before' readings to compare.

I've read where someone (don't recall the post?) posted that they didn't see much difference in using the dome top pistons and am wondering what gains they saw in compression. On the 113/123's I notice a real difference if I can get them over 140psi, but with this flat head design I don't know how much of a jump is feasible? Am I correct in assuming the flat heads in a fresh motor will give around 120psi? I plan on replacing the valves and porting the manifold/block. If there's really no noticable gains, I'd prefer not to waste the money...

Any other suggestions I'm all ears Thanks...

[Boss Hog]

Some will not agree but , like the higher compression 154 pistons and can tell the difference in power
David

[Eugene]

Engine parts. Suggest making a list of the needed parts then shop around. There is a big difference in prices. I find that my local auto parts store beats most suppliers on Cub C-60 engine parts when you figure in the shipping cost.

PSI. On a fresh engine, Yup on the 120 PSI - give or take a bit.

I would replace the parts with the same style of new parts as was in the engine. The engine only puts out about 13 horsepower, brand new. I wouldn't spend the extra money or effort to pick up 1 or 2 HP. If HP is your thing. You can pick up a little more HP by increasing the engines RPMs from 1600 to 1800 - not recommended. The HP increase is at the expense of torque.

Again my opinion. If you need more HP or more tractor than the Cub - buy a bigger tractor.

[Daniel H.]

You may have clearance problems with the domed pistons. I had to grind the combustion chambers in the head for the pistons to clear. I haven't ran the engine yet, so I can't speak to power. If I had it do do over, I probably would have went with the flat tops. There are several differences the number lo-boys used to get more HP besides the pistons.

Daniel

[BigBill]

If your going to use dome high compression pistons I would put some clay in the combustion chamber with the head on without a headgasket. Then put in longer bolts with springs so nothing gets bent and turn it slow by hand to see how much clearance there is if the head doesn't pop up. Besafe and check it first so there is enough clearance.

Being a new farmall cub owner there is a difference between my int154 cub in power too. After all the f cub has 9 or 10hp while the 154 has 15.4 hp right? Thats 1/3 more hp it has to be noticable unless the 154 isn't running good.

[Rob in NH]

i had my 66 cub rebuilt and the builder put in the dome pistons without any clearance problems and also the head had been planed too.before the rebuild i couldnt mow a full cut with the c3 mower, now i can mow uphill wich i could never do before. if i had to rebuild another i'd put the dome pistons in that one too.

[Eugene]

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewto ... horsepower

The above discussion has several horsepower to torque charts for the C-60 engine. If you notice the torque peaks at around 1600 RPMs but the horsepower increases as the RPMs above 1600 increase. Above 1600 RPMs as the horsepower increases the torque decreases.

[Alan Riley]

I'm letting the machine shop that's doing the machine work on my block get the parts from their supplier. I priced everything I needed from several sources and the machine shop's prices were competitive. By letting them order the parts, the monkey will be on their back if the wrong parts get ordered. I'll be doing the assembly work myself.

[Stan_VA]

Guys,
Thanks for all the comments, I'm still thinking about some of them but had a few more questions in the meantime... I was puzzled by the need for checking head clearance on the dome pistons because I was under the assumption that there was only one cylinder head offered (355691R2 in my parts books). But I found this comment in Ken Updikes Cub book on p.19, "IH offered a high-altitude cylinder head as optional equipment...". Does anyone have a part number for that head or actually seen one and noted any differences?

I've worked on experimental strokers before and understand using clay to check clearance on them, but didn't expect it to be an issue with (what I thought was) just one head and one standard stroke available on these motors. So, thanks for the warnings...

Eugene, thanks for that link to the earlier thread with the torque curves, that was helpfull. I'm still chewin on that will post back when my thoughts are straight

One last question, of all those that listed they have used dome pistons, are you all using the factory pistons from IH or are any of those aftermarkets (like from agkits or maybe you have found others that offer something)?

[Boss Hog]

Factory Pistons [ used ] no clearance problem but more power
David

[Rick Prentice]

I see that YTMag has flat tops (Tisco),

after experiencing the chinsy carb rebuild kits by TISCO, I'd be leary about any other products by them.

My .02,
Rick

[Boss Hog]

I dont like Tisco either there paint sucks but the case IH dealer will sell that stuff to you if you let them

[Lurker Carl]

You're unlikely to squeeze significantly more power out of a C60 unless radical changes are made to the basic engine design. The "domed" pistons raises compression modestly, to about 7:1, hardly the stuff dreams are made of. Some users claim a tremendous increase in power using those pistons but I believe their big boost comes from rejuvenating a worn out engine.

Torque, not horsepower, is the important number to chase. Rapid acceleration is seldom a desirable characteristic for farm tractors. Governed engines are designed to run at a steady speed regardless of load. Maximum torque, remaining relatively uniform throughout the normal operating range, is what manufacturers aim for and what most agricultural applications require.