Terrible first day with a Cub

[Bigdog5349]

I bought this 1957 cub for a project (my first tractor ever).

Got it for cheap and it came with a woods belly mower. I knew from the onset it was stuck. I'm okay with that. Fun project! It's been sitting in a warehouse for 20 years then out in a field for 2 months. The only thing missing on this tractor is the white 11 bar grill. Everything else is there and 99% original.

So I got it home and started disassembling. Got the head off and squirted the pistons full of PB blaster. I noticed these cracks (red arrows pointing toward them) between the coolant channels and wanted some advice.

They're not through the piston walls so I'm not sure if its a big deal or not. Could I put some of that copper stuff on it and a new head gasket and go on with life? They're not a result of a freeze, someone's just over-torqued those headbolts. I've seen a lot of threads about welding the side of a block or brackets or JB weld, but never really anything specific to this problem. If it's been covered already, my apologies.

The cracks and the stuck engine are not the terrible part. I've rebuilt things before and even if I have to find a new block, it comes with the territory of buying old tractors. This project is going to cost me the price of a perfectly operational cub. I drained the radiator into a small bucket and told myself "Put that in a jug immediately!" Then, I got a phone call and as I stood there talking looking off into the night, my 80 lb dog walked right past me and took a couple laps of ethylene glycol. I wasn't sure he'd even gotten any since i couldnt see him i just knew he was over there unmonitored for 10 seconds. I panicked, called the animal poison control ($75 per call btw) and was told to take him to the emergency vet (on a Friday at 11pm). Tested, found out he did in-fact get some. He's had to stay 2 days thus far getting fluid treatment. It's going to be about a $2000 bill, but I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I'd just let him die or cause kidney problems because I was too careless and stupid to drain the radiator directly into a closed container.

I told that story to say:I WILL FORCE THIS CUB TO RUN, EVEN IF IT HAIRLIPS THE DEVIL Otherwise this whole venture has been for naught, and I'll sell every bolt, nut, and washer on ebay to recoup my losses.

Thanks in advance,

Preston

[69ranger]

Welcome to the forum. This is a good place to learn, and there are many willing to share their accumulated knowledge with those of us who are not as experienced.

Too bad about the dog and the vet bill. I have had days like that, even though the circumstances were different, the end result was similar.... An empty wallet, and not much to show for it.

From your pictures, it appears that you have a pretty solid old cub, that is well worth fixing. I will defer to someone with more knowledge, regarding you block, or the cracks.
Blocks can be sourced from many places, including one of the site sponsors, also this community is a great place to pick up pieces that you need along the way.

There are events called cub fests, that might provide needed parts, and guidance. Look in the index for one near you, and try to attend.

The mower that you cub has, is a nice tool. These do a pretty decent job, of mowing cleanly, and handle taller grass pretty good too.
As long as you dont expect too much, as they are belt driven, and attached to a 9 horse power tractor.

Good luck with your project.

[Bigdog5349]

Thanks Ranger! I know it won't do miracles in the hp department. I just wanted it for some light mowing of grass that could really be done by a riding mower and to maybe push some gravel around with a mid-mounted grader blade.

[inairam]

This is my favorite year for the cub. JP tractor ( site sponsor below) sells casting including the blocks that come cleaned and inspected for cracks. I would give them a call. I have asked them for the casting number to try and match what you have.


Really sorry to hear about the dog. Had a bunch of vet bills lately.

[Bigdog5349]

Thanks for the advice! I'll check it out.

[Gary Dotson]

Just to second the advice above, J P Tractor is a valuable asset to the Cub community, give them a jingle. I, too have a 57, it one of my 3 favorite Cubs. Welcome to the forum!

[Pap]

Welcome to the forum Bigdog.
Good luck with your project and Enjoy Your Ride.

[Glen]

Hi,
The Cub operator's manual can help you learn about maintenance that the Cub needs.

Below is the 1955 Cub operator's manual. The experts on here recommend people read it. It has lots of info about operation, maintenance, and lubrication. There is a table of contents on page 1, and the index begins on page 79.
It shows how Cubs originally looked in it. The lube section begins on page 14.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... index.html

It shows the electrical system that a 1955 and 1957 Cub originally had.
Cubs made before mid 1964 originally had 6 volt, positive ground electrical systems.
They have said on here that IH didn't make a new manual every year.

The Touch Control fluid mentioned in the manual for the Touch Control, was changed later to Case IH Hy-Tran fluid. It is sold at Case IH dealers.
There are other brands, be sure it works with IH hydraulic systems before buying one.
The manual tells how to check and change the fluid, and remove the air from the system.
Check the fluid with the arms in the rear, or down position, the manual says.

I would check or change all the oils before using the Cub. Using it with low oil in a gear housing can damage the parts in the housing.
There are 3 separate gear housings, with 3 separate oil levels to check, in the rear area of a Cub, the transmission, and 2 final drives.

The transmissions in Cubs commonly get water in them, from rain, or condensation inside the housing over time.

The air cleaner is an oil bath air cleaner. Dirt that is sucked in settles to the bottom of the oil cup. It should have clean, light motor oil in the oil cup to work right.

There is a search at the top of the page, to the right of the Farmall Cub, you can search for info in posts that have been made.

Page 29 is gone from the manual, so there is no info about checking and changing the final drive oils, steering gear oil, and other things.
Below are 2 pages from the manual before it, the missing info is on them, beginning at number 24.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... age-19.jpg

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... age-20.jpg

[Bigdog5349]

Wow Glen! Thanks for the advice!

Right now I just want to get so far as to have the pistons back in. I've got to order rings and new rod bearings but I need to go get a mic first. I deglazed the cylinders this evening.

This tractor is very original. Its still got the 6v charging system. Its also the original wiring.

The gearbox was dry but there was no sign of rust. It had some milky oil in it though so ill probably fill it with kerosene and rinse it real good. The final drives seem to be working well but ill end up going through them before I try driving it.

Itll be a slow process but I've already gotten it un-seized and its been 4 days. Thanks for all the info though im sure ill be using it

[Eugene]

I enlarged the photo of the engine block to 400%. There appears to be a crack in the cylinder wall in the #2 cylinder, under your red mark.

[Jim Becker]

I enlarged the photo of the engine block to 400%. There appears to be a crack in the cylinder wall in the #2 cylinder, under your red mark.

It could be. I thought I saw one in cylinder 1. But the resolution just isn't good enough to tell from the picture. Most of the cracks are pretty easy to see, clearly are freeze damage. Based on them, I'd say the block is too damaged to spend much time or money on repairing. I see 2 options. If there is no damage beyond what can be seen in the picture, and the cylinders don't show a lot of wear (in other words if it isn't also worn out), I'd consider sticking the head back on with a new head gasket and using it as long as it lasts. It could be years. If there is more damage or it is otherwise worn-out, get a replacement engine or at least replacement block.

[Bigdog5349]

Jim and Eugene,
Thanks for the analysis. There's no cracks in the cylinder wall. If it looks like it, its just due to the photo quality since I had to reduce the size for upload. Also, it may be crud or carbon buildup. Like you said I'll likely just throw it back together and see how long it'll last. If it doesn't work I dont have that much in it. The valve train isn't in the best of shape but its really just dirty, there's no play in them. I had to get a couple of them freed up but now they're working fine. Cam looks great, crank looks great. Main seals aren't leaking. The pto engages perfectly with no rattling or clunking. I opened the fill hole for the hydraulics and it looked pretty gnarly in there so ill have to bust it apart when i get everything else back together. Heck the clutch on this one is better than any cub I've driven but that's just from rolling it down the hill. Ill need a few gaskets but I think I can make most of them. I've not tested the starter or generator yet. Worst comes to worst I may grind a small channel through those cracks, weld a bead in it, and shave it down as flat as possible. Whats the worst that can happen? If all that fails ill look at getting a new/used block.

-Preston

[Jim Becker]

I would probably not try any welding, just put it back together as-is. Cast iron can be pretty unforgiving to weld. Your best chance of it working out would require preheating the block, which in turn requires stripping it down. There you are into an overhaul.

Are there any cracks showing on the outside, ahead of the oil filter?

[inairam]

I agree with Jim, which I have learned is the safe bet due to his experience.

Either bolt it back together ( new head gasket of course) or replace the block. I do not see any logic in trying a weld the few cracks you can see with the naked eye.

If you stipped the block and boiled it and did a fluorescent penetrant inspection I am sure you would see more cracks that would you would not be able to weld. Or you start grinding the cracks you can see and it just keeps going. If you weld you probably could not grind it flat enough to get a good seal with the head without machining. Then the question would be is it the crack or the weld/ grind that is causing the leak.

These are tough engines. You would never have seen the cracks or known there were there if you did not pull the head. I am sure there are plenty of working cubs with cracks in the block at least as bad as what you have. Worst case you put on the head and it overheats and or you blow a lot of white smoke while you are right there to shut it down before too much damage. You are out a head gasket and time.

[Gary Dotson]

From what I can see, most of the cracks are in harmless areas. I wouldn’t sink a bunch of money into it but I think there’s a pretty good chance it will work okay. Spray a couple extra coats of copper spray on the bottom side of the gasket give it a go. If the cracks led to cylinder, valve seats or bolt holes, my opinion would be very different.